Run Power: Data Field

jtsang Thanks for the feedback.

TL;DR
The big fields in the middle should fit "9:59:59" without shrinking.
The smaller fields on the top or bottom should fit "9:59" without shrinking.
The layout is the way it is to support longer labels for metrics like "L Lap Max Pwr".

I realize this may not be ideal for everyone, but I was hoping it would be okay for most. I will look into ways to make this better, but probably not any time soon.

Maybe I will flip the labels and values (more room that way) and abbreviate further, like "LL +Pwr", although I don't know how clear that is.

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I looked at that field briefly and I noticed:
- Some fields are pretty narrow. I think the manual says that some fields have a limited number of metrics because of the space issues
In my datafield, you can put any metric in any field you want
- Some fields are so narrow they would never be able to fit the labels for the kinds of metrics I support. e.g. "L Lap Max HR"
I realize my layout doesn't make the best use of space in some times, but it's basically to support lots of different kinds of metrics. A lot of single run fields only have enough room for a label like "CAD" in some fields.

So I made some compromises for flexibility. There's a lot of stuff that Run Power does that Datarun Premium doesn't, like give you all this stuff for free. On that field I noticed that a lot of the power metrics are only available for large memory watches, etc., etc.

Also, I assumed that 3 digits for pace (9:59) should be good enough for most runners, at least during work intervals. 10 minute miles is jogging.

Shrinking just the hours will not help you with pace, and it won't help with the timer no matter where you put it, because the small fields are already too small, and the large fields already have enough room for "9:59:59". I could shrink the seconds, but I think nobody wants that.

Having said that, I will think about options (for large memory watches) to give you more space for your metrics, like adding an option to further abbreviate the labels and invert them with the values.

I could also possibly add a 4 field layout, with or without labels, for large memory watches, although I haven't heard anyone request that yet.

The problem with flexibility is you have to plan for the worst case.

Anyway, I think I've made a lot of changes and responded to a lot of user requests over the past four days, so I'll probably be pausing development until the new year, unless there's some bugs. (Especially with the experimental support for watches like 645 and VA3.)

jtsang Thanks for the feedback.

TL;DR
The big fields in the middle should fit "9:59:59" without shrinking.
The smaller fields on the top or bottom should fit "9:59" without shrinking.
The layout is the way it is to support longer labels for metrics like "L Lap Max Pwr".

I realize this may not be ideal for everyone, but I was hoping it would be okay for most. I will look into ways to make this better, but probably not any time soon.

Maybe I will flip the labels and values (more room that way) and abbreviate further, like "LL +Pwr", although I don't know how clear that is.

---

I looked at that field briefly and I noticed:
- Some fields are pretty narrow. I think the manual says that some fields have a limited number of metrics because of the space issues
In my datafield, you can put any metric in any field you want
- Some fields are so narrow they would never be able to fit the labels for the kinds of metrics I support. e.g. "L Lap Max HR"
I realize my layout doesn't make the best use of space in some times, but it's basically to support lots of different kinds of metrics. A lot of single run fields only have enough room for a label like "CAD" in some fields.

So I made some compromises for flexibility. There's a lot of stuff that Run Power does that Datarun Premium doesn't, like give you all this stuff for free. On that field I noticed that a lot of the power metrics are only available for large memory watches, etc., etc.

Also, I assumed that 3 digits for pace (9:59) should be good enough for most runners, at least during work intervals. 10 minute miles is jogging.

Shrinking just the hours will not help you with pace, and it won't help with the timer no matter where you put it, because the small fields are already too small, and the large fields already have enough room for "9:59:59". I could shrink the seconds, but I think nobody wants that.

Having said that, I will think about options (for large memory watches) to give you more space for your metrics, like adding an option to further abbreviate the labels and invert them with the values.

I could also possibly add a 4 field layout, with or without labels, for large memory watches, although I haven't heard anyone request that yet.

The problem with flexibility is you have to plan for the worst case.

Anyway, I think I've made a lot of changes and responded to a lot of user requests over the past four days, so I'll probably be pausing development until the new year, unless there's some bugs. (Especially with the experimental support for watches like 645 and VA3.)

Thanks FlowState. I think the current state of the app works perfectly fine on my Fenix 5 plus. Been using for the last 3 runs over 20 plus miles and it's been rock solid. My suggestion are relative minor and purely cosmetics, so not the biggest deal. I'm just glad there is finally a app I can program my structure workouts and get power alerts. I have to say this is by far one of the best app to run with power if not the best at the moment. Thanks again and Enjoy your Holidays.

jtsang thanks again for the feedback. Glad you find it useful!

Just wanted to explain the motivation for why it is the way it is. Sometimes devs do things that seem a little mysterious. At the end of the day, apps are for users, but sometimes you also make compromises to achieve a certain vision.

As I said, I would definitely like to look at improving that some day, as I think cosmetics are very important (sometimes deal-breakers), and this is a small issue with all of my "single-run" fields that I am aware of. I do happen to think the labels are important, but of course the numbers are even more important....

Happy holidays!

Update 4.1
- Fixed power meter pairing issue

^ Based on some in-house testing with an HRM. (The code is very similar).

I would still like some feedback on whether in-app pairing works with your watch and an actual power meter, if you have a 645/645M/Vivoactive. I don't see any reason it won't work now, though. Thanks!

thanks for your work on the data field so far. you were cranking out updates like crazy over a short period of time!

when you get back from taking a break, i do have one feature request: a new metric that displays current and 3/10/30 sec average power as a % of FTP (which would require a new setting asking for FTP).

i'm following a palladino plan that has very specific ranges. for example, 89-91% of FTP. to hit the right targets, one has to calculate what power values that range represents and then remember those numbers while running (e.g. 169 and 173). not an easy task especially when a workout might have two or three different ranges to remember.

having a % of FTP field would remove any need for manual calculation and be easier to remember. it also has the luxury of being consistent as fitness and FTP increases. for future workouts, one would only need to remember 89-91% instead of having to recalculate new power values based on an updated FTP.

an alternative would be to convert 89-91% to the equivalent power zone range (e.g. 5.2-5.5 with 5 being zone 3a on my garmin 935). however, that requires some manual calculation for each range. something that ideally could be avoided with a % of FTP calculation.

anyway, just an idea.

anyone else think this would be useful? i'm actually kinda surprised fields like datarun premium don't include something like it already. i'm new to training by power, so maybe i'm missing something? i generally prefer running _without_ target-based alerts which is why i've avoided the lap alert feature in run power. as long as i'm within range for the lap, i'm fine with fluctuations and don't want to be distracted by constant alerts.

i'm curious, how do others remember what ranges to stay within (particularly workouts that involve multiple ranges)?

alextran no worries. %FTP would be pretty easy to add for most watches. Probably won't happen for the "CIQ1" watches, which is the 920XT, Fenix 3 generation. But watches newer than that (like F5 and 935) should have room for "simple metrics" like that, and F5+ basically has unlimited room. Look for that some time in the new year.

BTW, you shouldn't get constant alerts. I pretty much copied the way 935 does alerts (at the moment). While you're on a given "alert zone" (low or high), you get up to 3 alerts, every 30 seconds. (The first alert comes after 30 seconds).

If you fluctuate a lot, I wouldn't expect to see constant alerts, because you probably wouldn't be straying from your target zone for the required 30 seconds straight.

Hopefully thats working properly.

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EDIT: you know what, %FTP was an easy change, so I put it in. But I'll be in bugfix mode for the next little while.

To anyone following this thread, every watch except Epix is supported now.

I don't personally find power alerts a very useful feature with current generation of power meters as there is too much variation and lag in power for it to be truly useful. You'll just be constantly readjusting and then there is also the fact your uphill / downhill power won't be the same as flat power anyway.

But who knows, oerhaps there are people who can actually run with alerts, as it still appears to be requested a lot, I'm just not one of them. :)

Still, great work as always and again some unique features that actually make running power features available not possible with other similar data fields.

BTW, How about adding power recording? Although probably most people use the Stryd IQ field for that...

But Stryd IQ doesn't give avg and lap power summaries, so that might actually be useful in Garmin Connect :)

JTH9 thanks!

Well, I think the way the alerts work sort of minimizes the annoyance from "too many alerts". Garmin used to do it differently (alerts as soon as you were out of your target range), and it was annoying. Now you have to be out of your target range for 30 consecutive seconds. You will only be alerted 3 times in a row, every 30 seconds, unless you "reset" the alerts by going back to your target range.

Yes, I copied Garmin, but they do a lot of things well (as much as we all like to complain).

I already added recording :P. Maybe I should make that clear in the store description and the first post. Also didn't know that Stryd doesn't give average and lap power summaries. Shockingly enough, Run Power already does that.... You do need a bleeding-edge Fenix 5X, 5+ or 645 Music tho.

alextran EDIT: you know what, %FTP was an easy change, so I put it in. But I'll be in bugfix mode for the next little while.

To anyone following this thread, every watch except Epix is supported now.

dang, you're a rock star. i wish i would've seen this earlier, so i could've tried it out on my run today. but will try the new version out tomorrow. thanks so much for getting this added! do you have a tip jar/donation page anywhere online? would love to send some love your way.

and good to know how alerts work behind the scenes. i didn't realize garmin changed the way alerts work from the 220 to 935. the new way is definitely less annoying and something i might look into using in the future.

Alright kids, this might be the biggest update to Run Power and I'm definitely taking a break after this, except to fix bugs.

Update 5.0

Fenix 5X, 5+ (all), D2 Charlie/Delta, Descent MK1:

Define your own custom metrics.

You get up to two custom metrics, with the formula of your choice, like "Power / HR". Don't see the metric you want in Run Power? Add it yourself.

https://ciq-appbuilder.blogspot.com/p/examples.html

Some other ideas for custom metrics (since Power/HR is already available <_<):
- Work: avg(Power) * Timer
- Power to Weight: Power / UserWeight

- Limitations: recording not supported, and power from directly paired sensor (by ANT+ ID) not supported.
If there's sufficient interest, these things may be added in the future.