F7 Series - lack of Feature Update compared to FR x55/x65

There is a lot to polish on just about every Garmin line. The software is outdated and full of bugs and every update creates more issues. Every time a new watch line is released to the public it is with software that is no where ready to be live, it is all Beta yet not classified as such and Garmin spends months/years playing catch up trying to fix it. 

There are software issues on these forums that are 2-3 years old that have yet to be fixed. A company of this size - there is simply no excuse for this. 

The 965 is still the latest Forerunner model. The Fenix 7 two models old now.

Garmin want to keep selling the 965. Garmin don't want to keep selling the Fenix 7 and instead want you to buy an 8.

The Fenix sells more units than the Forerunner 9xx, hence the Fenix gets refreshed more often to keep the sales ticking off.

I get that people are upset because they no longer have the latest model after a year or so, but it's kinda like buying a Toyota Camry and then becoming upset once the model gets refreshed in 12 months time.

Ya'll can get mad at me for pointing this out, but it's is how consumer driven markets work. Oh, if you want to point out that "Apple provides new features to the Apple Watch <N> which is <N> years old, remember that the Apple Watch is a device that locks the consumer into staying within the Apple ecosystem, keeping them buying new phones, Apple streaming services, airpods, apps etc. They can afford to barely break even with the Apple Watch, perhaps even run at a loss with it due to its ability to lock people in. Garmin don't operate this way and only make money when you buy a new device.

Garmin NEED you to buy that new Fenix, so the tasty carrot of new features will always be dangling in front of you, tempting you, telling you that you need it, that you're deserve to splurge on that new silly feature that won't actually make you fitter. It's upto you to resist that and only buy the watch you NEED for your training and lifestyle.

meuhbat said:

About the ECG in Europe, maybe they are trying to get money from the early adopters for a couple months and we'll get it later on the F7 pro?

It's a regulatory issue. Each device has to be certified by the authority within that country and this can take longer in some countries than others.

2529455 said:

Ya'll can get mad at me for pointing this out, but it's is how consumer driven markets work.

You can get mad at me for pointing this out but markets do not accept regressions in initially working functions, which is currently the case for Fenix 7 and Epix models. Introducing new bugs and breaking functions on existing devices is not how markets work. 

2529455 said:

It's a regulatory issue. Each device has to be certified by the authority within that country and this can take longer in some countries than others.

It is not only regulatory issue but how garmin performs their activities. They intentionally delayed doing what needs to be done for Fenix 7 pro and Epix pro to get ECG in Europe while they did what needs to be done to get ECG on Fenix 8 and Venu 3 approved. If they did the same for Fenix 7 pro and Epix pro, they would now have ECG. Why they did not do it? Answer is clear, to push users to newer devices. 

socorsu said:

Garmin are you listening to your customers ?

Obvious answer to that question asked many times in last 2 years is NO.

Garmin has a practice to avoid important topics. They just keep quiet letting important topics/threads go into oblivion. 

Vizi said:

You can get mad at me for pointing this out but markets do not accept regressions in initially working functions, which is currently the case for Fenix 7 and Epix models. Introducing new bugs and breaking functions on existing devices is not how markets work. 

We can agree that the watches advertised features need to work throughout its usable life!

Vizi said:

If they did the same for Fenix 7 pro and Epix pro, they would now have ECG. Why they did not do it? Answer is clear, to push users to newer devices. 

Agreed, absolute jerk move to push the certification of the Fenix 8 ahead of the 7. I get it from their point though because they'd end up with the 8 being less functional than the 7 which is arguably a worse position (marketing wise) for them to be in.

Bottom line, Garmin needs to move the Fenix 7/Epix 2 and Pro series over to the same firmware as the Fenix 8. There is absolutely no reason they can't, as the Fenix E is just a rebranded Epix 2 non-Pro. I would not be surprised if they are waiting to do this until they can get the Fenix 8 software at least as bug free as the Fenix 7 series software. I also wouldn't be surprised if they then use this software for the Forerunner 975/275...they need to consolidate their OS's if they hope to keep market share. We Shall See!

Saganist said:

Bottom line, Garmin needs to move the Fenix 7/Epix 2 and Pro series over to the same firmware as the Fenix 8. There is absolutely no reason they can't, as the Fenix E is just a rebranded Epix 2 non-Pro

Just because they can technically do that doesn't mean they should.

There are likely tens of thousands of costly engineering hours that have gone into the F8's firmware. Why would they give that away for free? To placate those who have Garmin some money 2 years ago and make them even less likely to buy an F8? What would separate the F8 in that case? Waterproof buttons and a mic no one uses? Folks would just buy a second hand F7 and apply firmware update, in turn making Garmin's refresh a sensationally poor investment and putting that whole org into a massive financial black hole.

I love free stuff as much as everyone else, but seriously, pop your business hat on for a moment and think about what makes sense.. You don't put multiple engineering teams on a UI refresh for a couple of years just to give it away unless you're making significant money elsewhere.

If your response is "well I'll just buy an Apple Watch then!" Great! Do it! Seriously, send that signal to Garmin it you think you're getting a raw deal. If enough leave, they'll change tack. If the sales keep going up then they won't.

First off, Garmin still sells watches that are one to two generations old, so they would make money on selling them. The problem here is the competition continuing to take over their pie is doing just that, updating not only a UX, but delivering core features with their releases to all their customers...Apple with consumers and Whoop with athletes. Apple spends the money to update one OS and delivers backwards to 4 years and about 10 different watches, the other is subscription and updates both the software and the hardware as part of that. Garmin is not really in the consumer space and is dwindling there fast, and if you watch sports, they are hardly in that space as well sadly and losing out on premium sponsorships. Your business isn't going to survive in this fast-developing market if you outdate your customers buying your highest end watch after literally one year. That and the competition is also eating your lunch on Wrist based HR and Sleep tracking, which is pretty much essential to athletes esp if they don't want to always be wearing a HR monitor. Why would anyone buy a Fenix 8 or even get ready to invest in a Fenix 8 Pro, there is literally no guarantee you won't have outdated software in a year after you buy the Fenix 8 Pro. Maybe Garmin decides to update more than the UX, and takes two year to make some core OS changes to add badly missing features that other smartwatches and fitness watches have...say Bluetooth FTMS, etc..., but they don't bring it to the Fenix 8 or Fenix 8 Pro...why would anyone invest in that model on an expensive watch? A low end, or lower mid level maybe, but a grand on something that could be outdated software wise in a year? That's laughable to me

Saganist said:

The problem here is the competition continuing to take over their pie is doing just that, updating not only a UX, but delivering core features with their releases to all their customers...Apple with consumers and Whoop with athletes

See the prior comments on how Apple, Whoop and Google are different from Garmin in that they have OTHER revenue streams enabled by these devices. The sale of the device itself doesn't generate significant profits but rather ENABLES other profit streams. Garmin only make a profit on SALE OF A DEVICE. That may change in future if they adopt the Whoop model, but right now it's not.

Saganist said:

Your business isn't going to survive in this fast-developing market if you outdate your customers buying your highest end watch after literally one year.

How many athletes upgrade their Fenix on every model launch? I'd guess it's just a small percentage based upon the commentary in the forums. It seems that most folks skip every other model, many even wait 5 or more years between purchases because the device they've got satisfies their training needs. Many only update because they've lost their battery life or a significant feature has been released which will make a tangible impact on their training. I personally wait 3-4 years (approximately 2 model launches) before enough new features accrue and enough battery capacity is lost to warrant me buying another device.

Ask yourself why you feel compelled to keep buying the new model. Why does it upset you so much to know that something newer has just been launched? Do you do this with vehicles, upgrading every two years! Does a new model Camry make your old Camry unable to do the job of transporting you?

Saganist said:

Why would anyone buy a Fenix 8 or even get ready to invest in a Fenix 8 Pro, there is literally no guarantee you won't have outdated software in a year after you buy the Fenix 8 Pro

Because the Fenix 5 or 6's battery is starting to die and they've got a race you need to train for? Seriously bro, I feel like you're buying just to have the newest thing rather than buying something that enables your training and adventure. Either admit that to yourself, or buy into a different brand like Apple or Whoop that gives you the feeling of "always being on trend".