New feature request: GPS accuracy in meters/feet + adding a satellite view app/widget

Are there any plans to expose the GPS Accuracy (in meters and/or feet) in the Connect IQ API and bring back the satellite view to the fenix 3? I've been using Garmin devices (GPSMAP, eTrex 30, Oregon 6xx, fenix 1, fenix 2, fenix 3) for the past 7 years or so and the drop of features such as gps accuracy and satellite view on the fenix 3 was a major disappointment for me (and judging by some forum posts not only me)

I assume Garmin wants to make these devices less focused on outdoor gps / hiking enthusiasts and more focused on mainstream consumers (i.e. less technically inclined people buying the watch for their daily run - much larger market) but in my view "dumbing down" the devices by replacing a perfectly usable objective measurement such as gps accuracy in meters with a subjective measurement such as "GPS Accuracy: Good" and removing satellite view will not gain new customers but will for sure result in some GPS enthusiasts such as myself eventually giving up on Garmin (when Oregon is going to be replaced I assume the new touchscreen handheld device will come with Connect IQ capabilities - if that device will "feature" GPS Accuracy: Good and no satellite view I for one will not buy that device).

The new Apple watch is coming out soon and as far as I know the GPS accuracy in meters is actually exposed by Apple for app developers to use (not an expert on iOS apps but I see that MotionX GPS on my iPhone does show the accuracy in meters) so if I teach myself how to write an Apple watch running/hiking app for myself and display the GPS accuracy in meters within that app, at that point my Apple watch will have a GPS enthusiast type feature that my fenix 3 no longer has. My point here is that Garmin's current attempt to 'dumb down' these devices in an attempt to be more Apple-like and gain more clients that way may backfire in the company actually loosing some of its core outdoor GPS enthusiasts market who would buy a Garmin device specifically because it offered more powerful features compared to the iPhone or Apple watch. As some of these power features are lost on the fenix 3 (and other upcoming devices?) then the question comes to mind, why not just buy an iPhone/iWatch combo and give up on Garmin? For now the fenix 3 still offers some things that the iWatch doesn't, longer battery life, waterproofing, sensors but I hope the point I'm trying to make above is clear...the right approach in my view is make garmin devices more simple to use for non-technical types but also keep the "power" features that GPS enthusiasts enjoy, don't just drop them! Non tech types may not care about GPS accuracy in meters or satellite view and just ignore them, but for people such as myself such features are the very reason why we are spending our hard earned cash on Garmin products..

Former Member over 9 years ago

I'm curious to know why people feel this information is so important. What do you plan to do with it? I'm not discounting your need for this feature, just trying to determine why it would be on your must have feature list. I've used Garmin fitness devices for years and never found any need for this.

Because .. this is the only way to know that your GPS truly has a good lock on your location.

I have a Forerunner 610 and I do not move anywhere until it is at 3-4 m of accuracy. That is cause in the past when I did not 'wait for it to get into a low number' .. it started my activity about 7 blocks from where I actually was. I should try to dig that activity up for you and post it .. and THAT is why this information is truly needed.

My feelings may change once I get my Vivoactive HR in a few weeks .. but for now, sorry don't trust it. Btw .. yesterday my F610 locked into the satellites at about 19m, so that tells me that it could have been out by up to 60 ft. Sorry .. not good enough.

EDIT .. here is the activity below. As you can see, the start and end are not at all close and I guarantee that I did start and end at the same place. This is why it is needed. After this activity .. I always make sure I waited until it truly locked on and have had no issues. So to say that there is no need .. is just wrong. There is a need.

I have also read on the Vivoactive HR forum about the GPS being "all over the place" .. so there is definitely a need to allow users to get a good lock. This accuracy measurement .. allows that good lock to occur. A 0-5 number does not cut it.

I don't necessarily want a satellite page .. just an accuracy field in meters like we have on older Forerunner devices where you can see your GPS accuracy.

Former Member over 9 years ago

I think the current generation of GPS HW used in these watches is very good, and are better than older generations of chips.

I likely am not going to use GPS anything in the Vivoactive HR (I will know more once I test it but for now I am skeptical).

Unless the Vivoactive HR can do custom workouts .. it is honestly useless to me. So I will keep my Forerunner on my wrist because as a running watch it is far superior to the Vivoactive HR.

Brandon.ConnectIQ over 9 years ago

@kevinf99: You'll see from the discussion earlier in the thread that there are technical problems involved with providing a more explicit accuracy metric (e.g. 10m accuracy) from the Connect IQ API because the values we would report vary so much from one set of hardware to the next. It would essentially be meaningless. For this reason, and after a lot of discussion, we decided against giving access to raw accuracy information in Connect IQ. This doesn't preclude the product teams from implementing their own GPS accuracy page that's tuned to their particular hardware, though.

The thing to keep in mind is that GPS relies on relatively low power radio signals transmitted by satellites orbiting over 12,000 miles above the planet. :) Our GPS receivers have gotten better over the years, so often acquire a lot faster than they used to and maintain a signal lock under much more adverse conditions than in the past, but you'll still have interference from trees, signal absorption, and signal reflection & refraction from surrounding structures & terrain, etc. Conditions are an important thing to consider, especially when you read complaints from people having GPS accuracy issues.

I understand that doesn't explain things away--I think the typical Garmin user (especially those that focus on fitness devices) will prefer to just grab their watch and go.

Former Member over 9 years ago

I understand that doesn't explain things away--I think the typical Garmin user (especially those that focus on fitness devices) will prefer to just grab their watch and go.

You are right .. and for me this is a non issue anyways as I will not use the GPS anyways on my upcoming Vivoactive HR anyways as it does not do custom workouts. Until I can do that .. I just will not go there. However cause I need to know .. I will check an activity file for GPS accuracy once I get the Vivoactive HR, but it will certainly not be my go to device for GPS.

However that does not mean that there is not a need for a good accurate GPS accuracy item as in past devices (even if most people will never use it). You can be sure that there are plenty of Forerunner users that would / do use that feature.

sis651 over 9 years ago

This is not a must have feature but I'd prefer to have a general knowledge of how many satellites it can see and lock with how much quality etc. Not as a CIQ data but a general satellite view page in settings would be perfect.

pgitta over 9 years ago

I agree with Travis and jim_m_58 that this kind of feature is much less useful on a fitness device.

But this device was not presented as ONLY a fitness device. I bought it for HIKING, and I want it to do and display EVERYTHING it is capable of doing and displaying. It's not a cheap watch. I would really like to know how many satellites I'm locked on to at the very least. even if its for fun, why cripple a device?

And satellite view to me is EXTREMELY useful. I have noticed my tracks are OK walking north through my neighborhood, but downright pathetic walking south. Clearly at that time of day, my body is blocking a sat probably low on the horizon. If I know where they are, maybe I would choose to move the watch to the other arm on a long hike to improve accuracy, considering how AWFUL this watch is at its very basic function. GPS.

Brandon.ConnectIQ over 9 years ago

Yes, I understand. This is a Connect IQ development forum, however, and the question of a satellite page is more of a product-level decision. It's kind of like requesting features for Apple's built-in iPhone apps in a Cocoa development forum. :)

I've already raised this issue with the product teams, so it's now up to them to decide whether to provide a satellite page on their devices.

guy_mx99 over 4 years ago in reply to Brandon.ConnectIQ

Any update on this folks? I'm having accuracy issues with my 935 and would love to see the satellite acquisition and accuracy like other GPS devices i have