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Digital Services Act Question. Traders or Non Traders

7780811
4 months ago

At https://forums.garmin.com/developer/connect-iq/b/news-announcements/posts/trader-verification the first question is:

  1. are you asking for money?

If you develop watch  faces for example, and sell though the Garmin merchant system, then does this question mean, do you ask for additional money once the watch face is downloaded?

I’m trying to understand if I am a trader or non trader. However, I had a good look at many watch face developers selling through IQ merchant system, and non of them had their address and phone number displayed. This indicates that they are non traders based on my understanding of one of the DSA requirements for traders. Can anyone add further clarification or guidance here please. 

edit. The link to the DSA registration in the link at the top is incorrect!

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  • 4 months ago in reply to 7780811

    Yes this was a bad decision to call them both Garmin Pay

  • 4 months ago in reply to flocsy🤠
    flocsy🤠 said:
    Yes this was a bad decision to call them both Garmin Pay

    Agreed. It has led to endless confusion from regular users (and even one big sports tech blogger [*] - not DCR) who incorrectly assumed that Garmin Pay for the CIQ store is identical to Garmin Pay for contactless payments, which would mean that the latter is subject to the same restrictions as the former, when it comes to supported banks.

    [*] This blogger wrote a whole article about how monetization was coming to the CIQ store, it would use Garmin Pay, but don't worry, you can get around Garmin Pay's lack of support for your bank by purchasing a prepaid credit card (or whatever). But ofc the limited availability of Garmin Pay in certain countries applies to Garmin Pay for contactless payments, not Garmin Pay for the Connect IQ Store.

    It doesn't help that the Garmin page for Garmin Pay seems to imply the above assumption is true.

    https://www.garmin.com/en-CA/garmin-pay/

    Most of this page talks about Garmin Pay as in contactless payments, but at the bottom, it talks about using Garmin Pay in the Connect IQ store. Not only do they have the same name, they are referred to in the same official Garmin page as if they are synonymous.

    So it's really hard to blame anyone for believing that the two usages of Garmin Pay are identical.

    It's kind of a replay of the problem where "Connect" and "Connect IQ" are so similar that people constantly post Garmin Connect feature requests in the Connect IQ App Ideas forum.

  • 4 months ago in reply to FlowState
    FlowState said:

    What about apps that were last updated long ago and are no longer being maintained by the developer? Perhaps the developer is no longer responsive/reachable?

    That's a good question, and something we haven't discussed much. At the moment, I don't know the answer, but we generally want to avoid removing content if possible. I'll have to ask about this.

  • 4 months ago in reply to flocsy🤠
    flocsy🤠 said:
    Please consider having different banners for these categories, so that users know the difference. Having the "Payment Required" banner makes a certain percentage (anyone's guess) of the users skip the app. They don't even read the description.

    This is already in the works. 

  • 4 months ago in reply to flocsy🤠
    flocsy🤠 said:
    Doesn't it mean that users "in the EU" * can't download the app?

    Prior to mid-January, if a developer was not verified under DSA regardless of whether their app is monetized it would be region-limited to be available only to users outside the EEA because we initially believed anyone distributing apps, even for free, would be considered traders under the law. We have since received updated guidance, and now anyone should be able to download the app you linked since it is not monetized even though FlowState is not yet verified.

    Under the new paradigm, only monetized apps are affected and we just hide those apps generally until the developer's DSA registration is complete. There are very few developers I'm aware of that have been affected—we had many developers register over the past year already.

  • 4 months ago in reply to 7780811
    7780811 said:
    I believe based on my experience, that the Garmin Merchant Monetization system requires that the IQ buyer has no option but to pay Garmin with Garmin Pay.

    We give developers the option to use Garmin's payment system or a third-party payment system on an app-by-app basis. It's true that if someone chooses to monetize an app to use Garmin's payment system there are no other options to purchase that particular app outside of what's available in the GarminPay wallet. You could publish two identical listings—one that uses Garmin's payment solution, and one that uses a third-party solution, but I think that would be confusing for users. 

  • 4 months ago in reply to Brandon.ConnectIQ
    Brandon.ConnectIQ said:
    Prior to mid-January, if a developer was not verified under DSA regardless of whether their app is monetized it would be region-limited to be available only to users outside the EEA because we initially believed anyone distributing apps, even for free, would be considered traders under the law. We have since received updated guidance, and now anyone should be able to download the app you linked since it is not monetized even though FlowState is not yet verified.

    Oh interesting, thank you for the clarification! That is welcome news.

  • 4 months ago in reply to 7780811
    7780811 said:

    Thanks, great reply.

    Brandon.ConnectIQ said:

    For individual developers (sole proprietors):

    • Support Email Address
    • City/State/Country

    Great.  That's what I wanted to hear.

    That has made things much clearer.

    This is great. So for confirmation, phone Number is NOT listed and FULL address is not listed

    I am part of the (problem) and just found my apps all are hidden. I adopted the "wait and see" approach exactly because of the above ( Full Address + Phone number). 

    I will need to see what I can do to register. What's a D-U-N-S for example and how to get one is also something I need to find out.

  • 4 months ago in reply to Nikeow
    Nikeow said:
    So for confirmation, phone Number is NOT listed and FULL address is not listed
    Nikeow said:
    What's a D-U-N-S for example and how to get one is also something I need to find out.

    Garmin requires a DUNS number for companies/organizations, not individuals (sole proprietors). If you register as a company/organization, your full address and phone number will be displayed in the store. If you register as an individual, you don't need a DUNS number (and your address and phone number won't be exposed).

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Data_Universal_Numbering_System

    TL;DR DUNS is a worldwide system which assigns a unique ID (DUNS Number) to a single business entity.