Related
This discussion has been locked.
You can no longer post new replies to this discussion. If you have a question you can start a new discussion

Native Power

danpinho
over 3 years ago

Is it too hard to implement such function since Garmin already have it on Edge family? If so, why even small companies such Coros provide it their clients?

It was a FR935 request more than 4 years ago. FOUR years!

I do believe that Premium Product buyers desert a bit more from Garmin, honestly.

  • 0 over 3 years ago in reply to danpinho

    Wow. You can't even read or write proper english and call other people out on their education? That's pretty low.

    Do some reading on how Power Meters work. 

    https://www.dcrainmaker.com/2017/12/garmin-running-power-good.html (and maybe put it through the google translator, so you really get all the facts ;-) )

  • 0 over 3 years ago in reply to maxkobe

    Running PM works on estimation. Cycling PM measure applied torque. I do have both and I know how it works!

    I am asking that the "broadcasted" signal from Rpower (whatever sensor it may be) to be Native on Garmin workouts screen.

    No, I am not "a" native EN speaker but it works as well the other languages that I do badly speak (if you prefer I can go along with DE, PT and ES).

    Anyways: your manners keep sinking. If cannot be a constructive person, just get F out!

  • 0 over 3 years ago in reply to danpinho

    Why are you so aggresive in all your answers ? You ask about "native" running power and now about using a broadcasted signal from a power meter (such as Stryd or the likes ?).

    I don't know about using such a sensor in a structured workout. What I DO know is that for running, especially for trail running, running power is just a fancy feature. The measure might be more accurate on a track, but still useless since time and distance are far more usefull and meaningful to build a structured workout.

  • 0 over 3 years ago in reply to danpinho
    danpinho said:
    Garmin HRM-PRO PM provides just the worst estimation out there ATM.

    There is no Garmin HRM-PRO PM. only Garmin HRM-PRO. The strap does not provide power information only heart rate data that is used to estimate running power.

  • 0 over 3 years ago in reply to danpinho
    danpinho said:
    Garmin HRM-PRO PM provides just the worst estimation out there ATM.

    Based on what? Do you have some real measures to which you are comparing these imaginary numbers so you can say that which one is off? 

  • 0 over 3 years ago in reply to jmto

    I can name a few but the best you can do is see for yourself.

    Power estimation is way above what the running community adopted as Standard (i.e. Runalyze, Jim Vance, to name a few) 

    Lag: For me this is the worst, after I ran a hilly section, boooom I have a peak power on Garmin (already on top). On graphs it looks good because of software corrections. If you do intervals base on Pace with Garmin+GPS you probably know this already.

    This is one DCR screenshot like 4 years old. Fellrnr have an even worst conclusion, quote:

    Getting your running pace from GPS is fairly useless, so it's not surprising that GRP's power estimate when using GPS as the speed source is pretty worthless. I typically see power estimates fluctuating by +/- 50 watts when maintaining an even effort.

  • 0 over 3 years ago in reply to Dr Phil

    At this point I can assume that Garmin need a strap with and/or accelerometers to deliver PW.

    You can name it whatever you want.

    Source: support.garmin.com/.../

  • 0 over 3 years ago in reply to Sylyon

    Why are you so aggresive in all your answers?

    The answer to your question is already your second paragraph:

    "I don't know about using such a sensor in a structured workout."

    ==

    You ask about "native" running power and now about using a broadcasted signal from a power meter (such as Stryd or the likes ?)

    Thats another why!

    ==

    The www.trailrunnermag.com editors have a very different opinion and so do I.

    I do trails and under threes and the first thing I loose is my pace. Fancy feature or not, it keeps pace/distance measurable under three or dense wood areas.

  • 0 over 3 years ago in reply to danpinho
    danpinho said:
    At this point I can assume that Garmin need a strap with and/or accelerometers to deliver P

    Assume what you want but none of Garmin HR straps calculate or deliver power. They only provide data for something else to estimate power. If you’re estimating power from heart rate then you are on a hiding to nothing due to the well documented factors that adversely affect heart rate - hydration, heat, fatigue etc. That’s just one of the reason why running power is next to useless.

    AFAIK only one strap every purported to calculate power - https://www.bikeradar.com/reviews/bikes/road-bikes/cycleops-powercal-review/. However, research showed it lacked validity and reliability - https://journals.lww.com/nsca-jscr/fulltext/2017/01000/validity_and_reliability_of_the_powercal_device.25.aspx

    That was for cycling as I’m sure will be pointed out. So into the journals for Stryd and we find this "Running power, calculated via the Stryd Power Meter, is not sufficiently accurate as a surrogate of metabolic demand, particularly in the elite population. However, in a recreational population, this training tool could be useful for feedback on several running dynamics known to influence running economy.” https://journals.lww.com/nsca-jscr/Abstract/2018/08000/An_Assessment_of_Running_Power_as_a_Training.19.aspx which is supported in this conclusion - “We conclude that the Stryd power meter provides valid measures of GCT and LSS but underestimates the absolute values of PO” from here - https://www.mdpi.com/2075-4663/8/7/103

    And Stryd is supposed to be the best. Garmin are wisely staying clear for the moment because there’s no benefit from incorporating a flawed metric natively in a running watch.