F851 - Started bootlooping

Not looking for troubleshooting, Garmin support, Chandin in this case, was great as usual even at 7:00 a.m. CST.   I deal with vendor support a lot in my professional roles for the last 30 years.  Garmin's has consistently been exceptional compared to the many many tech support teams I've dealt with. 

But here's my timeline in case this provides any assistance or insight for anyone else, some of these I'm sure are just random timings but trying to be as fully detailed as possible. 

Started a long run on Sunday, got a mile or so into and decided to turn on Event sharing over SMS.  You can't do that while you're in an activity so I stopped the run, turned on SMS, hit sync in GCM and watch rebooted. 

Watch came back up and a few seconds after the watchface appeared it would reboot.  I thought it had a crashed run stuck but I didn't have a way to get to the files to empty the activities folder out so...

Turned off BT on the phone.  Watch came back up.  Turned off phone connection on watch.  Turned on BT on the phone (for headphones).

Paired it with the phone, stayed up, started a run.

About half a mile in, started boot looping.  

Turned off BT again, got the watch to not pair.  Thought it might be a corrupt fit file so I used the System - Delete activities. 

Paired, rebooted. Said a few bad words.  Turned off BT again, got it to come back up, left it unpaired. 

Started a new run.  

Ran 4 hours, no issues. 

Stopped the run, tried to pair it to the phone.  It paired, synced the run and then the watch rebooted. I know the run was synced because it was visible in GCM now. 

But now it's caught in a hard boot loop. 

It reboots, shows the Fenix 8 splash screen, changes to Checking Maps, reboots.  Over and over. 

Go home, it's now sitting on the watch face so I use the menu - system - reset watch, delete user data.  

Watch came back up, seemed to be okay, put in my data, paired it to the phone.  Still okay. 

An hour later it's boot looping at the same Checking Maps point.  

Since I couldn't get to the menus, I did the vulcan nerve pinch to master reset it.  

Got it back up, didn't bother setting anything, just next next next. 

Paired it to the phone.  Stayed overnight and part of Monday, then found it boot looping again.  

Master reset it again.  Left it off pairing, no wifi, nothing.  Connected it to Garmin Express, no updates. 

Enrolled in the Beta and pushed 15.22 onto it.  As soon as it rebooted from the upgrade, it got to the watch face, rebooted. 

Back into a boot loop.  

Master reset it again.  Checked for any updates in GE, nothing.  

It stayed up for at least 4 hours but over night it went back into a boot loop which brings us to this morning. 

Contacted Garmin, started the conversation with a summary of all the above.  He asked for a video of the boot loop which I provided.  I understand this completely due to the number of posts I've seen since the F3 about people gaming the system to get new watches for things that were their fault.  

I had to master reset it again to get to the secret technician menu to try to grab a RAM dump but it was kind of pointless since it had just been master reset. 

By this time he's already arranged for an exchange for me and we're just troubleshooting.  

Now I'm waiting for it to crash but not go into a boot loop, which happens but is rare so I can go into the tech menu to try to save a snapshot of the memory for their engineering team. 

My feeling based on my professional experience is SOC or memory has developed an issue and is causing some memory corruption.  It happens.  The more complex a system is, the more things there are that can break it.  Yes we have 15 year old servers still in production at my company, we've also had system boards just fry for no reason months after deploying them.  

Long story long, just wanted to throw this out there in case anyone else runs into a similar situation. 

  • FYI there's an Install Software on the technician menu and I thought why not try it, can't break it any worse at this point but it just seems to do the same as a master reset. 

    It went through an identical process and after it came back up the watch is still on beta 15.22 after all the above soft and hard resets after it was upgraded to the beta.  Unrelated it seems they update the locally stored FW to whatever was installed last.  Unlike say keeping a copy of the shipping FW on it that you can then roll back to that way.   I kind of miss the rollback files from the old beta days where you could put on an old one and revert it back to older versions. 

    It appeared to crash after the FW was reset using that option as well.  It got to the watch face after what looked like two reboots during the flashing process, then after a few seconds went to the blue triangle again indicating a reboot for some reason and got stuck in the same boot loop, failing right after "checking maps"   I don't think I'm going to be able to grab a RAM file unfortunately as every time it goes into the bootloop I have to master reset it. 

    Interesting side note, if you plug the watch into a computer during the bootloop, it will pause and go to the charging screen and stay there.  Unplug it and it reports checking CIQ's, Checking maps, then crashes and reboots. 

  • Just a last follow up, I left it boot looping and it eventually made it to the OS without crashing.   I was able to connect it to GE and use the passcode given by the technician to submit crash reports through GE.  I also was able to pull a new RAM dump file through USB MTP and submit that.  

    Hopefully the data can help in the future.  :( 

    In better news, they've already shipped my replacement, I got a shipped notification about an hour after the tech support call.  I did have to cover the replacement cost to get it immediately versus sending in the defective one and waiting. 

  • That's why I have 2 so I have a backup when one is returned!! Only needed it once Weary tragic

  • I keep the last generation around for this reason but I'll say Garmin knocked it out of the park.  I had the replacement shipped within an hour of the troubleshooting call and it showed up at my door at 9:30 a.m. the next day.