When will garmin release a stable software version for Epix Pro with no problems at all for all advertised functions? Finally that's what i have paid for.

And again, it's about personal user profile and you're definitely not the typical runner/ biker/ hiker whatever the watch is made for. You're probably not using a lot of functions that others care about. 

But please stop then to tell others that your watch is working if you are using definitely other functions.

I'm running like a lot of other garmin users do and I care a lot more of those training metrics than you do. Can't you accept that?

And if those training metrics are totally destroyed by a wrong heart rate measurement the watch is useless for that!

The watch isn't made for retired golfers, it's made for athletes who want a good training analysis. And that's broken right now with the last updates!

Hi, FYI Garmin doesn't provide, and officialy allow, for downgrade.

Only advanced users know and backup (manually) the system and subcomponent files (until Garmin lock/hide them) to allow this.

Thanks for your reply. That's what I tried to tell Gerd_NL.

And again @Gerd:

I also had issues before the last updates, from the beginning with the first software version I got. So that's not an option at all to roll back!

By the way again, just tell me the official way to roll back to specific old software versions. Might be useful in the future, but not now.

I do not (permanently) tell others that my watch is working ...

If real athletes are buying a watch for their training analysis, then they normally know which analytics they need and are checking, which watch can deliver these analytics, so they should be able to test it if they own their watch, or???

And again, the HR variability takes at least about 3 weeks to setup. Before you will get nothing!

How can you test that in 14 days (time to return the watch for internet purchases in germany)? That's impossible unless you have time machine.

I don't get your point! The more we talk I believe you're a chatbot installed by Garmin to advertise their product.

Moderator: The Garmin Forum is a community driven discussion between Garmin users. There are no chat bots used by Garmin here. While a moderator like myself may step in to offer further assistance, or to moderate a discussion around the forum terms and conditions, we will always clearly identify ourselves and being Garmin. 

Good luck with your watch ... and you have a nice user name ...

You can't compare cars with software. Software development is extremely complex. Software that isn't in use for years can't be but but free. Cars use software too and this software has bugs too. That's how software development works. It's an iterative process. That's why you have version numbers. Sometimes fixing a big breaks other code that was working before. If you would know how many lines of code make an application you had talked differently. 

Your assumptions that Garmin is not aware of their bugs is also wrong. What you think is a small bug often takes serious effort to fix. Then you have to test the fix. Then you have limited resources like time and engineers that can work on a problem. At the same time you have to implement new features. It's absolute normal to prioritize bugs and features which leads to deferral of some bug fixing. 

It's impossible to release a bug free software that has a certain degree of complexity. Even cars have bugs that are usually more serious like brakes failing under certain conditions. You simply can't anticipate and test every possible scenario. Most of the time it's just luck that something engineered works under conditions that are not tested.

If you buy a product that heavily depends on software like smart watch it sports watch you must expect that you get many updates and that bugs are fixed iterative and successive. It's impossible to fix all known bugs at once unless you want to wait a year for the fix.

Such electronic devices are computers. They have a firmware, a operating system and applications. It's far more complex than just people think 

Software development is extremely complex. Software that isn't in use for years can't be bug free. That's how software development works. It's an iterative process. That's why you have version numbers. Sometimes fixing a bug breaks other code that was working before. If you would know how many many lines of code make an application you had talked differently. Your expectations is a bug free software are not realistic. Everything around you has errors and small bugs. Most people believe that software is a simple piece of work, because all they see are a few numbers in the screen. It's as complex as building an airplane and use the same time to manage the project and to assure product quality.

If you buy a product that heavily depends on software like smart watch or sports watch you must expect that you get many updates during the support period and that bugs are fixed iterative and successive. It's impossible to fix all known bugs at once unless you want to wait a year for the fix.

For example, software that is used in the medical section like in a respiratory machine is tested for years before they are released and used in a hospital to control devices that can't tolerate to fail. It software that controls a jet plane. Tested for years. Non-critical consumer devices like a smart watch are not tested for years as no consumer is willing to pay the price. It ate you willing to pay 10k for a bug free watch?

It's impossible to release a bug free software that has a certain degree of complexity. Even cars have bugs that are usually more serious like brakes failing under certain conditions. You simply can't anticipate and test every possible scenario. Most of the time it's just luck that something engineered works under real life conditions that were not tested or in the mind of the engineers.

As mentioned before there is a correlation between time and the number of bugs in EVERY kind of product. In nature we call this evolution.

During the live cycle of you watch you will even receive new features that were not implemented or ready for release when you bought the device. So you get something extra - for free. Or you change your point of view and understand that you have paid for a complex software (the software is the true product and not the housing you wear) and for all future versions that include bug fixes and new features. 

Then you need to understand how software development works and how challenging programming is especially when the applications run on small computers like a watch where processor performance, power/energy and memory are a limiting resource. Such electronic devices are computers. They have a firmware (hardware level software like driver software and programmable interfaces), an operating system that manages the hardware and provides a platform for the last software kind, the applications that the user interacts with. Then we have software tests, which is basically another application to test the product. This application is as big and as complex as the product application. Software engineering is far more complex than people can think. We are talking about million lines if code. Years of development and research. 

Your assumptions that Garmin is not aware of their bugs is also wrong. What you think is a small bug often takes serious effort to fix. Then you have to test the fix before you can release it. Then you have limited resources like time and engineers that can work on a problem. At the same time you have to implement new features. To use the available resources efficiently it's absolute normal to prioritize bugs and features which leads to deferral of some bug fixing. That's common for software projects and applies to project management in general.

Because of the complexity of the product, the origin of a bug is not always the application. Sometimes the hardware has bugs too. When the chip manufacturer releases a driver update to fix previous bugs or because algorithms were changed to improve efficiency, this new driver might break some operating system code. This will cascade into the applications. 

Because of the modern iterative product development, you have to be patient. Software products are very special in that they are continuously worked on. While the fixes and improvements of e.g. a toaster are implemenred as a new product that we must buy, software is updated and upgraded constantly.

Where is nothing like bug free software. And software features that were working correctly can get broken when fixing a bug requires to rewrite large portions of code. I think we can rely that Garmin will treat such broken releases as high priority. I'm not saying it's not annoying for the end user. But that's how software works. It's very challenging for the human brain. Maybe AI will improve that in near future. 

Maybe I didn't explain my point of view in the right way. I'll try to re-iterate the point. No other CONSUMER electronic device I have ever had has this amount of issues. The background you explained so well is valid for everyone but only in this case issues are so spread: I'm not asking a 100% bug free software but it's not acceptable to crash against more than 15-20 bugs/regressions in less than one year using just a fraction of the of basic functionalities.