Giving up on Garmin DSW / HM Training Plan - switching to Training Peaks and 8020 Plan

I eventually gave up trying to follow Garmin DSW and purchased an 80/20 HM running plan and a premium subscription to TrainingPeaks.

Initially, during the autumn, my problem was that the watch overestimated my Lactate Threshold and Pace by a wide margin. I did a lab-test in October to get accurate data and set the LT HR to the lab value. But the pace seemed to be stuck on higher values and could not be changed. I was not able to complete LT runs at the DSW recommended pace while the lab tested pace was OK.

Eventually this resulted in overtraining and injuries. I backed off and started doing only Easy runs at around 80 - 85% of the lactate threshold. The trainings come back as close to zero training effect and "No benefit". Not very helpful.

I feel I can no longer trust any suggestions from the watch nor the training feedback. What I get back from TP in terms of running stress and fitness at least seems consistent with how I feel.

I bought my FR965 after 20 years with Polar. Initially I was very impressed. Today I am very disappointed.

I should maybe add that I have a 20 year background as a consultant in embedded SW development processes. I am very familiar with agile development. But what we seem to lack here is making better use of the beta tester feedback (I am a beta tester). And to postpone a quarterly release if the SW is not up to acceptable standards.

  • this is a Garmin software issue since few months with the new implementations of threshold auto-detection feature, i analyze the .fit files generated by the watch in each activity and the issue is that the watch is getting the new values from wrong place, i dont understand how a company as Garmin have this software issue that a normal user can identify before them, i buyed my first Garmin few years ago, and was spot on, and i was very pleased, from 1 year to now its a completely mess of software issues, please dont follow the DSW if the detected values are wrong because will take you into problems, follow the suggestions but at your pace and fitness level if you want, o hope the engineers take seriously at this, and analyze the source of wrong data that makes DSW a joke,

  • I do not see a significant difference from the Daily recommendations that were provided before the change in the order of determination of the heart rate lactate threshold, and after the implementation of such changes. This applies to both running and bicycle training. For running, I train at a pace. For the bike, I train for power. The training zones defined in the new order (pulse zones, power zones, lactate threshold pace) are practically identical to those that were before.

  • Another day, another run and another showcase of Garmin software department brilliance.

    Went for a 41 mins easy run: avg pace was 5:40min/km, avg HR was 144bpm. Garmin tells me that it was Threshold run with aerobic impact score of 4.2 and exercise load of 181. Which is "interesting" because Garmin currently estimates my lactate threshold to be 167bpm @ 4:33min/km (and historically it used to fluctuate between 5:00 and 4:35). During this run Performance Condition was hovering between +4 and +9. I really can't see a way they could come up with these bizarre stats. They must be semi-random at best. Or maybe they ran into some data integrity issues and mixed up stats of many different users.

    By the way, a week ago I did a very similar 38 mins run with avg pace 5:47min/km @ 143bpm avg HR. And that one was Base with 3.1 aerobic impact and 83 exercise load.

  • I have repeatedly pointed out that the effect of running training is incorrectly determined. and do you use Stryd for running?

  • I use Stryd but not the training suggestions from the Stryd app. For me the Stryd critical power and race predictions are fairly accurate.

  • judging by the reviews, this is a problem for Stryd users

  • I use Stryd, but it's neither here nor there. Firsty, I run to pace, so it is pace, heart rate, distance and time that Garmin should use to determine exercise load. Secondly, even if it used power for whetever reason, I always run with my Stryd to provide me instant pace and distance data, so it should be consistent across all my runs.

    I wouldn't be surprised if we found out Elon Musk has been secretly running Garmin's software department and he's already fired 90% people who had any clue. Now the whole Forerunner universe has been left to rot...

  • so only one person ist left? Scream