Training Effect - inaccurate and misleading

What method are you using to calculate your zones, and where did you get your HRMax data from?

Hi. I did a full lab based series of tests, (blood samples etc.), which included threshold assessment, ramp test for MaxHR and highly accurate personalised training zones. I have no doubt about the accuracy - it’s scientific, matches personal feel and also matches what Garmin sees, for example an endurance run 80-90% in Z2. It just makes no sense that Training Effect ignores the base data and my zones and comes up with an over assessment.

As a first step, you have set your heart rate zones after your lab tests? And made sure that it's synchronized over to your watch?

If you hover over the zones of your activity, you will see the heart rate that defines the zone boundaries.

hi

the algorithms are broadly correct

the problem almost certianly will be with your captured hr data or incorrectly set hrmax/zones. you can argue this one as much as you like the answer will almost certainly be the same...

Hi,

I don't think this is the case, and speaking with friends this appears to be quite common.

I ran last night for almost exactly 60mins. Garmin had me in Z2 apart from a few minutes when I was in Z1. It frankly doesn't matter whether zones are set correctly (although I can state for the record they are), because 1 hour of Z2 should never read as anything other than Base

I'm wondering if Training effect is ignoring metrics such as age.

Reading on the Garmin blog, they state for the daily suggested workout that the Base run typically will be below 80%

"Endurance “Base” Runs

These longer endurance-focused runs will likely represent the bulk of your low-intensity training. And like recovery runs, part of the challenge comes from keeping the intensity of your efforts low. This is particularly true if your route of choice includes uphill segments where intensity can drift up quickly.

For experienced runners, endurance-based runs may last several hours, especially when training for a marathon. The best duration for your own endurance-building runs depends on your current fitness level and will typically vary somewhere between 30 and 90 minutes.

Keeping an eye on your heart rate is the perfect way to control intensity during your run. The HR zone you work to maintain during your endurance-building runs should be adjusted to match your personal parameters. This is typically below 80% of your maximum heart rate, so it’s worth checking to make sure your HR max is set correctly for you."

(https://www.garmin.com/en-US/blog/fitness/daily-workout-suggestions-for-runners/)

Since you have measured and know your zones, does your zone 2 fall below 80% of your max? I know that it doesn't have to be, and if yours aren't then maybe we are on to something.

The training effects are based on your heart rate settings and heart rate readings.  It does rely on accurate readings.  My effect score and impact wording are almost always pretty spot on with strap.  Rarely does it give me much for anaerobic , but that is due to my training preferences usually (don't do standing recoveries or super long recoveries between intervals). 

But if you really went out on a casual 90min zone 2 HR run, with HR < 70% of maximum HR for the run... then it should give you BASE / Endurance.  If you also happened to have some hills or HR drift causing 10-20% of run well into zone 3 (you mention part of run was not zone2...) then maybe that was enough to push it above. Or maybe you had a bad reading for a while (static on strap, or bad optical...)  IF , you have your HR zones all jacked with your custom zones, maybe that is effecting the score result. I have always had zones set on threshold HR or usually max HR, and it is good high sprint HR, only you can say if your ramp test went well driving HR to the highest you've ever seen.  If ramp was too long (or you were not well rested) it could have caused fatigue before you hit max.  Looking at past training and races for highest max HR in activity can usually find it or confirm it.  

If your 'endurance pace caused a moderately high HR, due to numerous things, not limited too... aerobic conditioning, stress, hangover, heat, time of day, etc...  then that is what it is.  BUT you did confirm that garmin zones were zone 2.  However if you have zone 2 as a large zone per a specific training doctrine/fit-test/coach... say zone2 is "62-78% of max" well that is a lot different then my zone2 of 60-70%.  Also a longer time at low tempo heart rate could also trigger a tempo effect, tempo HR doesn't mean tempo pace!  Tempo HR zone is huge (80-92%), including much of the grey zone (marathon pace up to faster than half marathon pace).  Zones are quite large and there is a big difference in training effect 70minutes at ~120bpm and the rest below in zone1.... vs 70min at 135 and the rest in zone 3.   My hour run sunday was zone 2 and low zone3 gave a Aerobic TE of 2.7, 'Base' .  (avg HR 69% and max HR 76% with HRM-Dual Strap)  This is with basic zones based on max HR of 194 (hit during sprint finish at a warm 5k, PR)

screen shots and/or specific numbers would really help 

the5krunner said:

the problem almost certianly will be with your captured hr data or incorrectly set hrmax/zones. you can argue this one as much as you like the answer will almost certainly be the same...

This!!!!

freemancj2002 The TE algorithms are based on % of MaxHR, so make sure of that datapoint in particular. zones have no effect on TE. I would also check your sport-specific HRMax and zones, and not just the general one. 

I also agree with NickMN - posting screenshots of your zone settings (from the Garmin Connect app) and numbers would help.

I think it just happened that your HR towards end of run drifted upwards causing slightly higher ave HR, thus Garmin considered this run as borderline tempo.

It would become aerobic if you bring ave HR just slightly lower.