Is there any way to customize recovery times?

My recovery times are way too short. Heavy, hard and very fatiguing exercises that I'm sore from for multiple days after, is given at worst 6 hours of recovery, sometimes it's more reasonable 24 or more, but in those case I still need approx 12-24 hours more time to recover than the estimate. So the watch keeps thinking I'm just not trying at all, ready to go at most times, while I'm nearing injuries and overreaching in reality. I know I should just disregard it and listen to my body instead, but I'm fairly sure that I'm failing at doing that, since I'm pretty sure I've recently pushed a bit too hard and am getting some overreaching effects. I still want to know the recovery hours, so I'd prefer a solution to this that isn't just "disable it/hide it" or "mentally just add more hours".

It started out seeming more accurate to my body's recovery needs, so I took it as a general guide, and for a bit it worked fine, I was recovered-ish around the same time that it got to 0 or very near 0 hours.

Would be excellent to give the software a bit of nudge, to recognize my actual situation, since I know for a fact that my body recovers slower than normal people. I initially thought the self-evaluation might do something like that, but It doesn't seem to.

This has also had the side effect on my training status, it's maintaining/recovery more often, even though I was actually constantly improving. Felt like I just needed to harder and harder, even though it seemed like a bad idea, because I was already trying to do that to improve.

For context. I mostly do cycling/indoor cycling and weight training. When I cycle my bike is pretty slow and heavy and the routes are filled with steep hills, I do wonder if the speed has an effect on this?

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  • Recovery times are for cardio adaption, not muscle adaption.

    Also, just because you're 100% "recovered", doesn't mean that you should be going 100% on your next workout, it just means your cardio system probably can handle it if it's what you choose to do. Listen to your body first and foremost.

    This has also had the side effect on my training status, it's maintaining/recovery more often, even though I was actually constantly improving. Felt like I just needed to harder and harder, even though it seemed like a bad idea, because I was already trying to do that to improve

    This just means your training load is low if what you're looking for is optimal improvement to your VO2 max. I wouldn't worry about it too much if you're only interested in strength.

    If you are interested in VO2 max improvements, then you're probably going too hard with the strength training and you're excessively fatiguing the muscles that you really need to recruit for the fitness training.

    If I were you, I'd be backing off on the workouts that leave me sore for days on end. It seems a little counterproductive if you can't work out again a couple of days later because of the extreme soreness. I'd be dropping the weight or the intensity to allow myself to have an overall higher training load so I can get a more balanced combination of strength and fitness adaption.

  • Recovery times are for cardio adaption, not muscle adaption.

    This is not correct. Adaption of muscles and of the body start immediately during and after the work out, and longer effects in general happens thanks to recovery. There is plenty of litterature about this. Just google "recovery & adaptation". 

    In addition, Garmin's recovery time is based on EPOC, which stands for Excess Post-Exercise Oxygen Consumption, which is the amount of oxygen above normal that the body uses after the exercise to restore homeostasis, ie balance

    My recovery times are way too short.

    Without more information, a reason could be that your training effect is underestimated. The typical reason for this would be that your Max HR is too high, or your rest HR is off. Wear the watch 24/24 to get a proper rest HR average.

    How did you determine your Max HR?

  • Recovery times are for cardio adaption, not muscle adaption.

    This is not correct.

    .This is correct when considering Garmin's determination of Recovery Time.

    There is no way, short of a wild guess, that Garmin's recovery times can consider any individual's muscle recovery after activity. The data used to determine Recovery Time is purely cardiorespiratory. So, while the body's muscles do indeed begin recovery after exercise if given a certain amount of rest/recovery, muscle recovery is not a factor in Garmin's determination of Recovery Time.

  • small question, how did you set your max hearth rate ? if you are overestimating it, or using any formula, that could be the problem. Ie, if you have a very low max hr (that is not a problem, nor a performance predictor, it's very personnal), then garmin may guess that you are doing base efforts, when you are just overreaching, as the hr is what is used to determine this !

    also, weight training won't contribute that much to it. it's mostly anaerobic, so do not expect this to be taken into account.

    As for overreaching (on the bike only, weight traning is another story), how often does it happens ? once in a while is good to push hard and get pain for 2/4 days, but not every week, that would question your way to approach training.

    hope that this may guide you towards a solution :) 

  • While using data from HR, HRV, output (pace, power), on/off in the context of V02 Max for the individual, Garmin’s recovery is estimating EPOC.

    EPOC is a measure of the physiological cost to restore the body to the state prior to exercise and get ready (adapt).

    This includes repairing distressed muscle fibers, restore blood chemistry and eliminate waste.

    So, yes, recovery time is including the entire cost of recovery and shorter term adaptations, including muscle recovery.

    en.wikipedia.org/.../Excess_post-exercise_oxygen_consumption

  • This has also had the side effect on my training status, it's maintaining/recovery more often, even though I was actually constantly improving

    Training status is based on VO2 Max improvement over a (I believe) 4 week period. If you've got a net increase over those 4 weeks then you're "productive".

    This is obviously a cardiovascular measurement only, much like recovery time.

  • Recovery times are for metabolic recovery. While muscle recovery requires metabolic recovery it is not included in the Recovery Time metric Garmin provide. It cannot be so as there is nothing in the metric than can assess muscle protein or minerals that recover muscle. It is well possible for the body to be determined to metabolically recovered, ie 0 Recovery Time while the muscles are still sore or fatigued. It takes many weeks for muscles to recovery after long multi-day/hour activities yet the Recovery Time can be, and is, often down to zero in a couple of days. 

  • While muscle recovery requires metabolic recovery it is not included in the Recovery Time metric Garmin provide

    Yes it is because recovery time is based on EPOC

    It cannot be so as there is nothing in the metric than can assess muscle protein or minerals that recover muscle

    Again, EPOC is the basis for recovery time. No need for chemical analysi.

    It is well possible for the body to be determined to metabolically recovered, ie 0 Recovery Time while the muscles are still sore or fatigued

    Let's not change the conversation. We are not seeking the "muscle recovery" that you seem to define by elimination of soreness or elimination of fatigue but the physiological recovery state so that training can be continued and adaptations built over time while reducing the risk of injury.

  • physiological recovery state so that training can be continued and adaptations built over time while reducing the risk of injury.

    Metabolic recovery in the context Garmin present as Recovery Time (cardiorespiratory recovery) does not, and cannot be used to determine physical recovery of tired/damaged muscle. This is where the individual needs to determine whether or not, and how much, to load muscles. Suggesting that the Recovery Time metric provided from Garmin is sufficient to determine muscular loading post long activity is misleading and can cause less knowledgeable people to overload.

  • Suggesting that the Recovery Time metric provided from Garmin is sufficient to determine muscular loading post long activity

    I don't suggest this at all, and Garmin's recovery approach either. The EPOC approach is enough to evaluate how much recovery is needed before new training can occur so that adaptation happen during the entire stress/traing, recovery & adaptation cycle.

    I mean, I don't know, this is the basics of training.

    Maybe the muscle recovery concept is a red herring in the context of training, since we don't want muscles to "recover" back to where they were. We want them to adapt, along other dimensions and capabilities in the body.

    I am going to break these news to you:

    - the watch is capable of giving you a VO2 Max estimate without measuring your O2/CO2 gaz exchange during the workout,

    - the watch is capable of giving you a threshold heart rate estimate without having to analyze the lactate in your blood during exercise,

    - the watch is capable ot anticipating your recovery needs during exercise, without having to measure "muscle proteins and minerals" to assess muscle recovery.