How to set the barometer as a weather indicator tool?

I set the altimeter manually to the known local altitude (337 meters in my case). I switched off the altimeter autocalibration based on GPS. I set the same altitude in the barometer settings, then I set the sea level pressure at 760 mmHg (as this is the well known standard, right?), and I finally set the Watch Mode to barometer. Now the altitude is frozen at 337, even when I descend 3 floors from my apartment (at least 9-10 meters equivalent) to the ground. The only parameter which is changing is the barometer pressure, it changes slightly from 760 mmHg to 760.7 or so, when I descend from the third floor to the ground. When I'm at the third floor, staying inside my apartment, the barometer is almost frozen most of the time (ranging between 759.8 and 760.1). I must mention that the real time pressure in my city is now around 735 mmHg and rising, as the local weather station shows. I'd like to see the barometer changing according to weather changes, so how should I set the altimeter/barometer in order to achieve that? Or is my watch a lemon? The sensors/software are broken? I need your advice. Thanks.

Later edit: I just discovered an Ambient Pressure widget, which shows 733.4 mmHg, very close to the real pressure measured by the local weather station, which is 735 mmHg, as I already said. OK, so, what is the difference between "barometric pressure" and this "ambient pressure"? Is one influenced by the other? Can someone explain? One more thing, in this widget, under the 733.4 mmHg pressure is displayed the altitude (which is 337 meters, as I said), and another pressure indicator (I suppose), which shows: 766.4. So what does this represent?
  • Pressures in Garmin terminology:
    Ambient Pressure:
    The true ambient pressure at your location, measured by the pressure sensor in the watch.
    The value changes with the weather.

    Barometric Pressure:
    The equivalent pressure at Mean Sea level.
    This value also changes with the weather, synchronous with the Ambient Pressure.
    In barometer mode, the watch calculates Barometric Pressure from three variables: The true ambient pressure at your location, your known altitude and an assumed density of the air column between your altitude and Mean Sea Level.

    You mention that you have a manual setting for sea level pressure in the watch. I do not have this setting in my Fenix 3. I assume that the setting is intended to be used in altimeter mode in the special case where you do not know your initial altitude, but you do know what the equivalent pressure at Mean Sea Level is right now at your location. But there is also a slight chance that the setting is somehow used for adjusting a calculation offset if your local weather station uses another air density for calculating the equivalent pressure at Mean Sea Level, compared to what the watch uses.

    In either case, it is important that you do not just input some textbook average value for air pressure at mean sea level. The actual value changes all the time depending on the weather and your location. You need to use the actual value. If in doubt, I would not set anything.

    Your experiences:
    You have told your watch that you are at a constant altitude. So any ambient pressure change measured by the watch should be used for calculating a new Barometric Pressure.

    Your stair experiment shows that it did, but perhaps not as much as it should. A change of 1 mm Hg should be equivalent to an altitude change of 6-7 meter. So your 9-10 meter altitude change would have caused an ambient pressure change of around 1.5 mm Hg, and the change to the Barometric Pressure should be almost exactly the same. But it was only half of that. This can have two explanations:
    • The ambient pressure sensor did not pick up the full change in ambient pressure.
      You may not have given it enough time, since the pressure measurement is somewhat averaged over time to prevent noise.
      This would be easy to verify by repeating the experiment, but this time you should look at the Ambient Pressure value, not the Barometric Pressure value.
    • Your manual input of sea level pressure somehow screws up the calculation of Barometric Pressure. If you watch both the Ambient Pressure and the Barometric Pressure, and they do not change by the same amount, I would suspect this to be the reason.
    Your observations over time in your apartment seems to verify that explanation #2 above is the reason.

    Your readings from the Ambient Pressure widget points in the same direction.
    In my watch, the third value in the widget is equal to the Barometric Pressure shown by the watch. If they are different in your watch, and you see the third value changing as much as it should while your Barometric Pressure reading doesn't change as much, I would again suspect that your manual input of sea level pressure was the reason.

    However, you should be careful with the Ambient Pressure widget. As far as I can see in the discussion thread for this widget, the widget developer did not have access to all values in the watch while he wrote the widget, so he had to calculate some of them. The interface has recently changed so widgets can now access the necessary values directly, but I can't remember if this widget has already adapted to this. So there is a risk that the widget shows you a result of some indirect calculation.

    Instead of using the Ambient Pressure widget, you could just make a custom data screen inside an activity app, for example the Walk app. This screen should contain these data fields:
    • Elevation
    • Ambient Pressure
    • Barometric Pressure
    • Temperature (not needed now, but maybe later).
  • I didn't input any mean sea level pressure this time. There is a difference of 3 mmHg between the barometric pressure shown by the ABC and the one shown by the ambient pressure widget, which is equal with the difference between the ambient pressure shown by the widget and the real ambient pressure shown by the local weather station. If I change altitude, the difference of 3 mmHg remains the same. What should I do next?
  • Hi.
    Sorry if the question sound stupid but what is the "ambient pressure widget" and how can I find it?
    What do you mean by "In barometer mode" ?

    :o
    Best Regards
    Itsik
  • Ambient pressure widget is a Connect IQ widget which you can download from their store through the phone app.
  • I didn't input any mean sea level pressure this time. There is a difference of 3 mmHg between the barometric pressure shown by the ABC and the one shown by the ambient pressure widget, which is equal with the difference between the ambient pressure shown by the widget and the real ambient pressure shown by the local weather station. If I change altitude, the difference of 3 mmHg remains the same. What should I do next?


    First of all: I now discovered that you are using a widget called "Ambient Pressure", and I am using a widget called "AirPressure". They seem to be much alike, though. I just installed the Ambient Pressure widget on my watch too.

    On my Fenix 3, I get the same barometric pressure from the ABC widget and the two Ambient/Air Pressure widgets. And I get the same ambient pressure from the ambient pressure datafield in a custom data screen in the Walk app and the two Ambient/Air Pressure widgets.

    So I can't explain the difference that you are seeing between the ABC widget and the Ambient Pressure widget. Perhaps you should try installing the AirPressure widget, and if it has the same difference, you could try to ask in this thread which is about that widget:
    https://forums.garmin.com/forum/developers/connect-iq/connect-iq-showcase/93955-widget-airpressure

    Regarding the difference in ambient pressures between your local weather station and your watch: If the offset is always the same, I would just live with it. The variations are more important to me than the absolute values.
  • OK, one more thing, regarding the storm alert. As you can see from this link: http://m.meteo.ro/vremea/166/starea-vremii-in-Piatra_Neamt.html , there was a 3 hPa pressure drop in the last 3 hours, exactly like my watch shows, so the watch gave me a storm alert (being set on the most sensible pressure change, of 2 hPa), but in reality, it's still sunny and no storm or snowfall has come yet. So, is the storm alert just a gimmick or should I just raise the alert limit to 3.5-4 hPa/3 hours or even higher?
  • My knowledge of meteorology is limited, though I have had some lessons during my sea kayak education. So take the information below with a grain of salt:

    As far as I know, the best indicator of wind is the pressure change over distance at the same time. You can see this on a weather map with isobaric curves. The closer these curves are spaced, the stronger wind you have. But of course you can't do that with a single pressure measurement device, so we have to use something less optimal instead if we want our watches to do it.

    When using pressure change over time at the same location, there are several unknowns. For example, in the centre of a low pressure, the weather is usually better and wind is of course lower. The bad weather and the strong winds are located around the centre. When you see a pressure drop on the watch, you don't know if you moved into the centre or you just moved closer to the centre and closer to the area with the bad weather. Also, if the low pressure is moving fast over the map, you may see a high pressure drop rate, but there may actually still be a long distance between the isobaric curves.

    So the storm alert is probably a quite crude indicator which will either have a lot of false positives or a lot of false negatives, depending on the sensitivity setting. And I guess that is why Garmin made the sensitivity configurable by the user.

    I do not have the storm alert enabled, but I do from time to time look at the barometer curve on the watch. I have several times seen the pressure change linearly 6 millibars over 6 hours, which would be equal to 3 millibars over 3 hours or 2.25 mmHg over 3 hours. Sometimes when this happens, the weather is fine.

    Right now, I again have 6 millibars over 6 hours, and the weather is really with a lot of rain and winds of 10-19 meter average speed (20-38 knots). So this time a storm alert would have been right on the money.

    If you want to use the storm alert, I guess you will have to experiment with the sensitivity until you get an acceptable ratio between false positives and false negatives.
  • I set the storm alert to 3.5 hPa/3 hours, maybe it will be more accurate. In the meantime, I was downtown and after few hours in the city, when I got home, I discovered that the altitude in my apartment raised with 60 meters or so. LOL. I guess altitude must be manually recalibrated at least once per day, right? Is this normal?
  • I set the storm alert to 3.5 hPa/3 hours, maybe it will be more accurate. In the meantime, I was downtown and after few hours in the city, when I got home, I discovered that the altitude in my apartment raised with 60 meters or so. LOL. I guess altitude must be manually recalibrated at least once per day, right? Is this normal?


    You have just seen a change of 3 hPa in 3 hours. 1 hPa equals an altitude change of 8-9 meters.

    So yes, once per day or even more often sounds about right.

    What I don't understand is that your watch shows an altitude change in barometer mode. Or did you disable barometer mode again?
  • I used the GPS to track my walk in the city, but the Auto calibration for the altitude was set to OFF, so...I don't know why the altitude changed. The watch was in the same barometer mode, like it is now. So, it's a software bug or what?