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Garmin Coach Amy: questionable strategy with low paces?

I just completed a 17 week 10 k Garmin Coach training plan with coach Amy. Unfortunately, I didn't perform during the race as I would have liked to, but I'm not surprised:

  • The training load was not lowered until three days before the race. So I had to run 14,5 k on Tuesday, 6,5 k on Wednesday and the 10 k race on Saturday.
  • Although I configured my desired target speed at the beginning of the training plan, I never ran that speed for a longer distance during the whole training plan. Only the supersets contained a short distance at such a high pace.

I managed to run at higher paced for a longer distance earlier this year, but I was not able to run with such a high heart rate any more. You could say I was out of training. It was an experiment for me to see how the training plan works, so I'm not disappointed about my performance during the race, but about the Garmin Coach. All the time, the Garmin Coach was confident that I will achieve my goal (green, far away from orange).

Are there people with the same experience? Is this a kilometer/miles problem?

  • I've just completed my second time trial 8 weeks into the 10k 52 min goal plan with Coach Amy at 7.54 mile I notice the upcoming workouts are now longer but with lower paces. So goal pace repeats have changed slower by 1 minute 9.15 which is easy pace for me and I have previously run half marathon at 8.50 pace. So time trials play a part in workout pace calculation.

    But I love the Garmin coaching system as it gives me a plan, gets me out more and keeps me fit.

    But likely if I I was very serious about faster pace and time then I'd be looking for something more bespoke.

  • I'm the same, no option to input target pace. I'm in week 2 and it's extremely boring, got me doing nothing but 1 and 2 mile easy runs

  • I just read all the answers to your post and I experienced the same problem in my 10k plan. In week 9, after my mile time trial, the goal pace repeats were suddenly lowered by a minute. Previously, I was running them at goal pace (48 min = 7:43 min/mi +/-10 seconds - or 4:48 min/km +/-6) and that was challenging but doable. Now, they are suddenly 8:33-8:53, which is slower than the steady state run at 7:56-8:44. I tried to pause and restart the plan, it didn't help. Then I lowered the goal pace to 47:00 which didn't solve the problem, just lowered everything by 9 seconds per mile. But it also shortened all the workouts. I really like the longer workouts so after a few attempts to reset the plan and just making it worse. I stopped it. I don't think that running at those paces will help me achieve my goal. I need to run near goal pace, at least at the beginning of the plan, and then approach it as I'm getting closer to race day. First running at goal pace and then reducing that by a minute midway through the plan doesn't make sense at all. 
    I've considered starting the HM plan but now some of you are telling me that it isn't better but does the same slowing down of the paces midway through. Also, the lack of taper is counterproductive. Maybe I'm going back to Greg. I did 2 plans with him, 5k and 10k, but I didn't like that easy runs had a prescribed pace. My HR zone 2 pace can vary greatly on the day and the prescribed paces usually had me near zone 3 or in it. That's what I liked about Amy, not giving an easy pace so I could concentrate on running easy without stressing about pace. I also like getting some cross training tips. But the speedwork becoming slower midway and that's putting me off this plan. Progression should look different, imo.

  • I am in week 6 of 17 (5 days a week training plan) - and maybe this helps:

    first things first: in difference to e.g. Coach Jeff, Amy gives (quite) nothing about cadence - For me Coach Jeff was too serious about cadence, but it is - as I realized in the last month - a mayor point:

    + for me it is is a mayor support to run with "cadence" - you find videos on youtube from "Drumset Fundamentals" - I used to have a cadence of 150 and now I leveled up from 155, 160 to 165 - 165 might be perfect for "slower pace" - for me 7:20 minutes for 1000 meters where I can run with a AVG HR of about 135. But try it for yourself  - you can also train it "at home" while running on spot with specific cadences. (You can also make walks of 1 hour or longer this way to improve steps per day or even your VO2Max (when windows are opened) - give it a try)
    The mayor point of "running with cadence" is that you don´t have to take any guess about "how to run" (which might cost loads of energy) - you can keep this cadence for your individual pace and - to take a break - run on one spot and keep the cadence. You need WLAN while running - you also can download this video on your Mobile, e.g. with 4k Video Downloader. Finally: changing cadence can easily mean to really change your running mode - give it some time but from 150 to 165 it is likely no negeative effect - use the "running at home on one spot with cadence" to test cadences.

    + use the bike to support your endurance. A solid endurance on bike is (very likely) from very great importance for your running endurance. Together with daily walks (10.000 steps a day) it is another solid fundament for your running endurance. Try to make bike tours of 45 minues or longer in aerob areas. Also a bike tour is a great way to have both a relaxing unit and a unit that strenghs your endurance.

    + for me, while running, the information of "lap pace" and "current heart rate" is the important information. keep your heart rate in eye any(!) time and - in case it increases - take a walk break or step on one spot - - it might be frustrating for the first runs and weeeks but keep it up. The heart rate might be not too accurate but it is (very likely) "quite accurate" and it is the basic of Garmin Coaches´ measerings for further training plans.'

    Ma Da Erlangen (garmin) :-)

  • I agree, cadence is an important component of running dynamics. Faster cadence makes it harder to overstride and it just feels smoother overall. It's not a problem for me because I'm routinely in the range 175-190+ spm, 175 for really easy runs and 190+ for speed work on the track. Races are usually in the range 185-190.

    And that is not the issue here. The issue is that the Coach Amy programme suddenly switches to much slower paces which do not prepare you for running at your goal pace for the race duration. The OP was disappointed with his race performance because they were undertrained.

    The super sets only help somewhat, and they also get slower after half of the plan. I really miss traditional tempo runs where I'm running a certain time at race pace or close to it. Maybe 10-20 seconds slower at the beginning of the programme to ease into it but then I would need sessions at goal pace. The opposite is happening with that programme. I guess you haven't advanced far enough in it to get that sudden shift in paces. Have you already done your mile time trial midway through it? I think it was in week 8 or 9.

    Now what I want for a 10k is the following: Classic tempo runs 15-20 minutes at goal pace or slightly slower. Or breaking it up into 4x 6-8 minutes at goal pace. Plus a lot of base endurance training at lower HR - for me, thats around 1:30 minutes slower than race pace where my HR is still in zone 2.