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Am I really that unfit Garmin????

Former Member over 4 years ago

I'm 46 years old male. Been a kickboxer all my life. I can do 100 proper form press ups in a row, sometimes up to 150 if I push it. On week days I do (every day) 100 situps in 5x sets of 20, same with squats. Press ups 5x sets of 30 normal then 5x sets of 20 in various positions ending with a stress test of my maximum which is normally between 60 and 100 when fatigued. I do x2 intense coached kickboxing sessions per week including endurance rounds on the heavy bag (minus sparring at mo due to social distancing rules). I do a two mile run every day (it's just a trainings run so I don't bother going further and I only get a 30 minute lunch break)

On weekends I take a break and do a couple of 4 mile walks.

Yet, according to Garmin and my Vivoactive 3 watch, my VO2 max is 42 - which is "fair" .... it did go up to "good" once but then dropped again after a run where I went under trees and it thought my pulse was 150 at walking pace due to poor GPS signal! I am 100% convinced that I am fitter than that!

I am neither under nor over weight. What's going on? Why is my apparent VO2 Max so low?

0 Bitti over 4 years ago

First, VO2max is quite personal, and there may be individual differences that affect how Garmin (Firstbeat) measures and calculates it. So I've noticed that it's more useful to look at how it changes, not what the absolute value is.

Otherwise, how long have you used the watch? Is it still learning? VO2max is only calculated from runs (and cycling with power meter), so maybe there's something in those short runs you do that makes more accurate estimations difficult.

Also, since you mention your inaccurate pulse once (it's not caused by poor GPS but by cadence/heart beat interference): make sure you wear the watch correctly and tightly enough (or even better, use a HRM strap). If the watch regularly locks onto your cadence instead of your pulse, it might well explain why it comes up with an inaccurate number.

(I personally have a VO2max that sounds believable, and it even stayed mostly the same when I switched from TomTom to Garmin. Both use Firstbeat's algorithms, so maybe that explains the same numbers.)

0 Former Member over 4 years ago in reply to Bitti

Many thanks for your reply. I may have not worded it correctly... under the trees I was still running at a pace that kept my pulse at 150, but because the GPS signal was poor under the trees it thought my pace was lower when I was running at the same speed. As a result, my watch thought my pulse was at running beats at a pace that was not corroborating reality.

0 Former Member over 4 years ago in reply to Former Member

had the watch since Christmas but have only added the runs in since lockdown, so about 5 to 6 months of daily 2 milers

0 Bitti over 4 years ago in reply to Former Member

Ok, I misunderstood. But that kind of occasional problem shouldn't affect VO2max calculations. Firstbeat's algorithms try to filter out "anomalies" where heart rate / pace ratio doesn't keep constant. Then it only takes into account those segments which it considers "consistent".

(See for example Figure 1 in this Firstbeat's paper: https://assets.firstbeat.com/firstbeat/uploads/2017/06/white_paper_VO2max_30.6.2017.pdf)

0 Bitti over 4 years ago in reply to Bitti

(For me, there seem to be minor fluctuation in VO2max estimate depending whether I'm doing a long slow run or a tempo run. I get slightly lower readings for long slow runs, but usually just +/-1 point. But on the other hand, my body tires during long runs, so my VO2max will definitely be lower on average during a long run, I guess.)

0 Bitti over 4 years ago in reply to Former Member

You could try adding a longer run into the mix for a while (if you have time) and see how it changes the situation. But anyway, VO2max estimate is more geared towards endurance sports, so it may not be a good indicator of your fitness.

0 Former Member over 4 years ago in reply to Bitti

Those are great replies. Thank you. I will try and do a longer run at some point just to test it... I can keep running for miles and miles - it's just time is the problem

0 LJSkywalker74 over 4 years ago

One other thing to consider which you touched on is your weight. You said that you are neither under nor overweight. However, given your kickboxing interests, would you say that you are pretty muscular? Not like a bodybuilder, but do you also not look like the typical endurance athlete, really thin and lean? The reason I ask is that VO2 max that Garmin uses is relative VO2 max, not absolute VO2 max. This is a calculation that takes your body weight into consideration. So for example, let's say you are 5' 8", 12% body fat, weigh 165 lbs with versus another person with the same height, body fat% but weighs 135 lbs. You both have the same absolute VO2 max capabilities however, the lighter person is going to have the better VO2 max score on their Garmin because the VO2 max shown there is based up oxygen uptake per kg of body weight.

0 trux over 4 years ago in reply to LJSkywalker74

because the GPS signal was poor under the trees it thought my pace was lower when I was running at the same speed. As a result, my watch thought my pulse was at running beats at a pace that was not corroborating reality.

So why don't you simply make another run?

0 Former Member over 4 years ago in reply to trux

Ok... so, I was running with others, at their pace. I have done a couple of 2 milers at my fastest manageable pace. I am now showing a score of 45, upper end of good with a "fitness age" of 20.

But this goes to prove the score is unreliable as now, if I do a run with my 12 Yr old son, it will think my slower pace is all I can manage and lower my score.