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Livetrack issues unacceptable - Why isn't this high priority and deemed critical ?

I am well aware that there are several other posts about the current state of Livetrack on the Android platform, but I have intentionally created a new thread.

As a software engineer and architect of 25 years who has worked on both desktop and mobile platforms I am well qualified to comment on the current situation, and I find it unacceptable.

Lets analyse the situation as it stands, point form:

1. A system that was working perfectly for months, if not years, previously is now suddenly completely broken in multiple different ways.

LiveTrack refuses to start at all for many users, sometimes it will only start manually and not automatically, and sometimes it will start both manually and automatically, but then it refuses to stop automatically if it started automatically.

That's 3 separate and distinct issues with LiveTrack that have now appeared at the same time, out of nowhere, directly related to recent updates to the Garmin Connect app for Android.

2. A multitude of different users are all reporting the same issues, all of whom did not have these problems previously, which clearly indicates to me that the problem lies squarely with the Garmin Connect software on Android (or possibly compatibility issues between that software and the latest version/s of the Android OS), and it has nothing to do with customers hardware or customers doing something wrong.

Re-installing the Garmin Connect app does not fix the problems permanently or properly.

Deleting all application data for the Garmin Connect App does not fix the problems either.

3. Having re-installed the Garmin Connect software on my Samsung Galaxy S7 Edge, which has never had any problem running Connect or Livetrack before, 4 times in the last 3 days, and observing that re-installation only temporarily fixes the problem, I can safely say that re-installation is NOT a solution to the current issues, certainly not with the current version of the software.

I haven't trained for several months due to medical problems, but when I stopped training everything was working perfectly my side, with the SAME phone and the SAME Garmin Edge 520.

Now I come back a few months later, install all the pending updates, and suddenly things that were working, literally for years, simply do not work anymore and are completely broken and unusable?

I find this state of affairs to be completely unacceptable for several reasons, namely:

1. First rule of deploying software updates live is: You do not remove functionality unless you plan to replace it with something better and you NEVER introduce changes that break backward compatibility or are considered breaking changes in any way.

2. LiveTrack is a SAFETY feature that many people rely on, and is one of the best things that Garmin have done on their platform, and yet there appears to be no sense of urgency to fix this problem? Why not?

I fail to understand how these current LiveTrack issues are not deemed to be Critical Severity A issues that warrant an emergency hot fix. Where I currently work, something this damaging to the company's reputation, having this much of a negative impact on users, would immediately be escalated to our highest severity level and our developers would basically LIVE at the office until this was resolved and a hot fix was released to patch this ... WITHIN 48 HOURS maximum.

3. If Garmin know that it's their software causing this, and I think we can all agree that it's patently obvious that it is at this point, but they don't know how to fix it and are battling to pin down the root cause, then they need to ADMIT that and COMMUNICATE with their user base properly, instead of ignoring all of us and refusing to deal with the issue.

Have they never heard of public relations?

Having spent the last 3 days of my life fighting with the Garmin Connect app and LiveTrack, having LiveTrack work when it feels like it (in different ways, apparently depending on the time of day, the phase of the moon, and who knows what else), or not work at all, I am now at the end of my tether.

This is not new software and not even a new feature in existing software. This was working perfectly, for a very long time, and somebody did something to break it, and Garmin need to figure out who did what, and fix it. And they should do so as a matter of urgency, not take 6 to 8 weeks to maybe release a patch, while they refuse to communicate.

Furthermore, this is not even difficult to reproduce. I've managed to get it to break multiple times in the last 3 days, in multiple different ways, without even trying to break it. In fact, I was trying NOT TO break it.

@Garmin: What is going on? What are you doing to fix this? Why is this not being dealt with urgently as it should be? Why are you not communicating with your users properly?
  • Add me to the list of unhappy users. I'm using a Garmin 810 and Samsung Android Galaxy (Verizon). I believe it quit working about October or November of 2018. I uninstalled and reinstalled the Garmin Connect Android app on my phone. Re-paired the phone with the 810. No help.


    DavidMcQuinn, scan back through this discussion and you'll find my post with reference on how to roll GCM on your phone back to version 4.8. That is the last version that has worked consistently for everyone.
  • I certainly hope it is not using the phone's GPS data, that would deplete the phone battery by using it's GPS unnecessarily. Why do that when GPS data is already known on the watch which already has to send to the phone all the rest of the parameters you mention.

    I did a quick test using my VA3 and Samsung Galaxy S7 running GCM 4.8. It is NOT using the phone GPS. The phones GPS indicator has not come on in the 5 minutes the test is running yet LT is showing my location. Maybe this is a change they made in the later versions of GCM that are having the problem, I can't tell that as I'm not willing to update my GCM until this darned bug is confirmed fixed.


    My wife said it took a few minutes to initially kick in, but it did give more or less live information of where I was at any given time. However, it no longer shows your intended route like it used to when riding a preset course. The new 'feature' seems to be that each time you stop the clock and then restart, it seems to chuck away what's gone before and start again. It would be nice if it could be restored to its former glory. I'm pretty sure it uses GPS data from the Garmin device, not the phone.

    Yesterday's ride was slightly different in that it 'restarted' after I had to wait a junction (don't think I stopped the clock) but then DIDN't restart when I stopped for a break a little later.

    There's definitely something a little odd and 'stop-starty' going on here, but it seems to show current position.
  • ..version 4.8. That is the last version that has worked consistently for everyone.

    I hope it was a fluke, but I had the "No signal, trying to reconnect.."thing today with 4.8.
    Auto start worked, email was received, but not one datapoint on LT webpage for the entire 2 hour run.
    Probably a one time thing due to some other issue, there are more 'symptoms': extremely slow sync and transferring courses via GCM is not working anymore.
  • I hope it was a fluke, but I had the "No signal, trying to reconnect.."thing today with 4.8.
    Auto start worked, email was received, but not one datapoint on LT webpage for the entire 2 hour run.
    Probably a one time thing due to some other issue, there are more 'symptoms': extremely slow sync and transferring courses via GCM is not working anymore.


    I had the "no signal" thing with my setup today too with the latest GCM. No other obvious issues with GCM for me, but I've been using courses already on my devices this week.
  • Former Member
    0 Former Member over 6 years ago
    Hi folks,

    I was wondering if you could help me solve a tech problem or if you have any suggestions...

    My daughter races in road races and crits. I would like to monitor her sensor data in real time (as she races). We have Garmin Edge 520 and iPhone 8 on the bike side and Android and iPhone on the spectator side. I had hopes for Garmin's LiveTrack, tried it out, and can see what mess it is...

    Garmin claims that LiveTrack can (in theory) stream sensor data:

    Use Garmin LiveTrack to Track Activities in Real Time
    https://www.garmin.com/en-US/blog/fitness/use-garmin-livetrack-track-activities-real-time/

    "Invite your friends and family via email, Facebook or Twitter. They will receive a link to a webpage that includes the position of your phone or connected device. They’ll also be able to track your activity time, distance, speed and elevation in real time. Data from any ANT+® sensors you may have — such as heart rate or cadence — can also be viewed on your LiveTrack page."

    I can't make GPS tracking work. Forget about sensors... In our age, when we stream HD video/audio over cellular networks, I can't believe it that we can't stream a few sensor readings updated every second.

    Has anyone succeeded in streaming sensor data (speed, cadence, HR, power) in real time from bike to "friends and family"? Any suggestions how to implement this?

    Thanks
  • Has anyone succeeded in streaming sensor data (speed, cadence, HR, power) in real time from bike to "friends and family"? Any suggestions how to implement this?


    It used to work really wellbefore they messed it up. Streaming sensor data and routes and position. Worked well for me between July 2018 and late October 2018. It appears that they are on the case, but we don't know how long it will take to fix.
  • Former Member
    0 Former Member over 6 years ago
    Thanks, Alex. Do you remember how often LiveTrack would refresh the sensor data (once a second, once a minute)?

    Garmin - please fix LiveTrack!
  • There is information on how to install the old version 4.8 some way back in this thread. With 4.8, both the tracking and the display of graphs of speed (pace), cadence, heart rate and altitude works really well. 4.8 works great, and has failed me only 1 time out of ~50 activities, so I'm not updating the app anymore unless I see lots of good reports on a newer version.
  • Former Member
    0 Former Member over 6 years ago
    Thanks, Twinaxx. I've downloaded 4.8 on my Android phone and tried it out. So far, it works. Fingers crossed.

    It took me a while though to find cadence, speed, and HR data in the Web browser. One has to use a desktop version of the site (if on mobile) and click on the "GRAPHS" frame at the bottom of the Web browser screen. It opens a sliding frame with relatively small graphs. The graphs are updated about every minute, with a latency of a minute, and with a batch that has data resolution of about 4 seconds. Maybe data has a higher resolution, but the mouse-over snaps at 4 sec. increments. It keeps adding graph data with every update, compressing the graphs horizontally. Races longer than an hour would probably look very dense and hardly readible.

    I have a feeling that once a minute LiveTrack fetches data from Garmin's internal .FIT file (coords, distance, speed, HR, cadence, etc) and sends it over cellular network to the web server for rendering. Good idea, but the implementation and user interface are not there yet.

    Well, my definition of "real-time" is 60 frames per second :) I'd be OK with 1 update per second in this case. But, this thing makes 1 update every 60 seconds and with a 60 sec latency... What I need is to see on my smartphone, what my daughter sees on her Garmin Edge while racing, updated once a second with a second latency. Very simple. I don't need graphs, just numbers. I hope that Garmin will eventually get there.

    I'll try LiveTrack with longer races later this week/month.

    Any idea where I may find the 4.8 (IAP) for iOS/iPhone?

    Thanks.