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Will Garmin cripple topo maps?

POPEJ.
over 13 years ago
Garmin is adding new features to maps and outdoor devices. The same features are added to BaseCamp, so probably this could be a place to discuss them.

New feature is called ActiveRouting and is present in Topo Germany 2012 Pro and Topo TransAlpin 2012 Pro. Some information are available in German here:
http://www.garmin.com/de/topo/activerouting/

You can download sample of new maps here:
http://static.garmin.com/shared/de/custom/topod2012/testversion/TopoD2012pro_Testversion.zip
http://static.garmin.com/shared/de/custom/topod2012/testversion/GarminTransAlpin2012Pro_Testversion.zip

ActiveRouting allows to create routes optimized for a chosen activity. There is a set of new activities, that you can see in recent BaseCamp: walking, hiking, mountaineering, bicycling, tour cycling, mountain biking, ATV, dirt biking etc. For each activity there is dedicated routing and displayed map looks different. In the latter case only trails appropriate for an activity are displayed.

Demo maps include SQL database with tralis. I think that supported devices can perform search for nearest trail.

What is wrong? First there is only limited set of devices, which fully support new maps. It is Montana, 62/78, Oregon x50. Some basic support will be included in Dakota, eTrex 20/30 and Edge 800. All other GPS are summarized under name "old devices" with no support.

Second and main problem: it doesn't look like an added feature but rather like removed feature. Practically Garmin has removed all marked trails from new maps. If you own a supported device, than you can have some trails back, but not all at once. If you choose hiking, you won't see bicycle trails. I don't think triathlon is supported on any device ;)

Some example, first hiking. All marked trails are red. I don't know if there are colors in marking of trails in Alps but it looks like Garmin decided that hiking trails are always red.

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Here mountain biking. Trails for bicycle are always violet.

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And here sample from previous version of TransAlpin with all trails visible:

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I might be missing something but my first impression is disappointment. In my opinion Garmin has crippled new maps. Removing touristic information from maps makes them less usable. And limiting map use to predefined activities seems very artificial.
  • Former Member
    0 Former Member over 13 years ago
    Practically Garmin has removed all marked trails from new maps. If you own a supported device, than you can have some trails back, but not all at once. If you choose hiking, you won't see bicycle trails..

    I've said this before but I think this is part of Garmin's long term marketing strategy. Instead of making devices that serve multiple purposes (e.g. the 76CSx) make many devices that only serve certain uses (e.g. nuvi's for automotive). In short beak the GPS market into many segments to increase profitability.

    I currently have some topo's on my nuvi 1490T. I see no reason to update them. Its possible a firmware update may stop them working but as I've said before I archive those.

    I have all the devices I need right now but if I had to purchase a new one I'd be very very careful and do as much research as possible before buying.

    I think I'll also start archiving CN maps (gmapprom.* files) just in case functionality and/or data is removed as an "update". I already save the current version but not previous ones.
  • Former Member
    0 Former Member over 13 years ago
    Has either of you folks seen the problem regarding map visibility I ask here? The problem has gotten worse since MapInstall 4.0.1. Now both install methods result in the top screenshot. Maps look fine on all my handhelds. So far transparent topos or with maps created by garmin.openstreetmap.nl show OK.
  • Former Member
    0 Former Member over 13 years ago
    Thanks for the info about ActiveRouting - I had never heard of this before and based on your description, I don't like it.

    The Nuvi was never positioned as a device that was intended for topo maps, although they have always worked. But the display style has never been so great IMO.

    But each new series of the Nuvi line seems to mangle a topo map more and more. This began with 1300/1400 series, which draws big fat elevation contours that are wider than the roads. It also renders wetland areas as though they were lakes and typically doesn't show all the map POI. And if the map contains DEM (like US Topo 100k and 24k) it is rendered in a style that makes some of the map features almost unreadable.

    -Boyd
  • Former Member
    0 Former Member over 13 years ago
    I cannot comment on this too much, as none of this really applies to BaseCamp.

    But I do believe that Topo were always made for the Outdoor market, not the Automotive market.
  • Former Member
    0 Former Member over 13 years ago
    But I do believe that Topo were always made for the Outdoor market, not the Automotive market.

    I don't think that was the point of POPEJ's concern. I stated, as an aside, that I have some Topo's on my 1490T. I, and others I'm sure, fully realize that automotive units aren't designed for outdoor use.
  • 0 over 13 years ago
    I cannot comment on this too much, as none of this really applies to BaseCamp.

    Could you tell as how will new topo maps look in BaseCamp? What functionality we will gain or loose? What I'm afraid is that ActiveRouting actually means removing marked trails from map view.
  • Former Member
    0 Former Member over 13 years ago
    BaseCamp is supposed to display the map according to the activity profile selected. So e.g. if the user selects a biking profile, the bike trails should be displayed more prominently.

    BaseCamp should also route correctly, according to the selected activity.

    BaseCamp should also support Finding Named Trails, and routing along Named Trails.

    All this is in 3.3.

    I am not aware of any functionality loss, we didn't remove anything in BaseCamp that I know of.

    I am not aware that any trails were removed from the map view. Activity Routes just display differently and the goal was to make it easier for the customer to find routes that fit his/her preferred activity.
  • 0 over 13 years ago
    So e.g. if the user selects a biking profile, the bike trails should be displayed more prominently.

    I have tried with demo maps and this worked differently. Actually there was no bike trails visible when I selected hiking mode. Was it an error?
  • Former Member
    0 Former Member over 13 years ago
    BaseCamp is supposed to display the map according to the activity profile selected. So e.g. if the user selects a biking profile, the bike trails should be displayed more prominently.

    Is this a feature built into Garmin's proprietary maps, or should it work for DIY vector maps that work on Garmin handhelds using third party compilers (cgpsmapper, mkgmap)?
  • Former Member
    0 Former Member over 13 years ago
    Is this a feature built into Garmin's proprietary maps, or should it work for DIY vector maps that work on Garmin handhelds using third party compilers (cgpsmapper, mkgmap)?


    It's a new feature in Garmin's proprietary maps. Garmin does not support cgpsmapper or mkgmap, so I cannot comment on that. But I would assume that these tools would have to change if they wanted to support Activity Based Routing. But I do not know much about these tools, so I could be wrong.