3.2.1 Boom!

I have updated to Basecamp3.2.1.I ended up losing my Library under My Collection.And It was replaced by a recovered Birdseye Imagery List( I didn`t lose it to begin with.)Then I started to get a Warning"Cannot load the following Areas".Under which was listed Birdseye Imagery and KML Data.Under that was another" Warning Data could be lost"then it ask,"Do you want to attempt to fix the Data?".Then it gives you the option to Fix or Cancel.And also the new basecamp version no longer shows how many Waypoints,Routes,Tracks,Birdseye Imagery,Garmin Custom Maps,Geocaches and Geo-Tagged Photos you have .This was a very useful feature.It was at the bottom of Basecamp on a pull up menu.Now there is no longer a pull up menu.Please bring it Back!.

You still have all that in the Data view. BaseCamp starts in Map view by default.

I stand corrected,I did find the data view with the number of data that I had .But still lost my lists under My Collection.

I was about to ask where the data view with the number of data was because I can't find it myself, but I finally got it. Normally the data view is on the left hand side, and that view shows everything in a list with the search box at the bottom. Swap data and map views and the list now shows on the right side (although the collections/library are now on the left, over the map). But the search box is now on top instead of the bottom, and the number of data bar is to the right of it. Switch it back and it disappears. Lovely.

With all due respect, 3.2.1 is an alpha release at best. Since upgrading I've had the "corrupt-data-missing-do-you-want-to-fix" message twice now that when fixed leaves me with an empty collection. The UI is clumsy, inconsistent, and incomplete. Need examples? Clumsy: floating windows that now obscure other portions of the UI and a tiny map overview that's one step away from unusable. Inconsistent: toolbar buttons that don't have corresponding menu items and vice versa. Incomplete: swapping data and map views does not result in identical views.

Yeah I know I'm venting here, but like many of the users on this forum my frustration levels are soaring. Is there constant pressure from the Garmin big-wigs to push these updates out the door? Is any pre-release testing performed ouside of the development team? Believe me, I really want this program to succeed (mainly since there's no alternative) but I can't help but feel that there's a critical lack of planning when it comes to these release cycles.

With all due respect, 3.2.1 is an alpha release at best. Since upgrading I've had the "corrupt-data-missing-do-you-want-to-fix" message twice now that when fixed leaves me with an empty collection. The UI is clumsy, inconsistent, and incomplete. Need examples? Clumsy: floating windows that now obscure other portions of the UI and a tiny map overview that's one step away from unusable. Inconsistent: toolbar buttons that don't have corresponding menu items and vice versa. Incomplete: swapping data and map views does not result in identical views.

Yeah I know I'm venting here, but like many of the users on this forum my frustration levels are soaring. Is there constant pressure from the Garmin big-wigs to push these updates out the door? Is any pre-release testing performed ouside of the development team? Believe me, I really want this program to succeed (mainly since there's no alternative) but I can't help but feel that there's a critical lack of planning when it comes to these release cycles.

I need some more concrete examples: which toolbar buttons do not have corresponding menu items (and vice versa)?

What do you mean by: "swapping data and map views does not result in identical views"? What do you expect to happen?

Tiny map overview? You can adjust the mini map size to your liking.

Yes, the floating windows overlap stuff. Before we have received many complaints by users that they felt there was not enough screen real estate left. So we moved the properties and the mini map out, leaving much more room (especially on wide screen monitors). Testing (and most user feedback) showed that overall people liked this change.

I apologize for the "fix" issue, rest assured we are working on it.

What do you mean by: "swapping data and map views does not result in identical views"? What do you expect to happen?

See the two attachments. On data left, the search box is at the bottom of the list and no buttons are available for filtering. On data right, the search box is at the top and now I have filter capability, but now the map controls are gone from the map view.

I need some more concrete examples: which toolbar buttons do not have corresponding menu items (and vice versa)?

Properties menu item has no toolbar button (and no hotkey).
Print has no toolbar button (although "New" does).
Recenter Map up, Align North have no toolbar button (but they have hotkeys).
Detail level toolbar has no menu (and is a toolbar that can't be turned off).
"Vehicle type" toolbar has no menu (and is a toolbar that can't be turned off).
Pan/Zoom/Select/Measure toolbar have no menu (can't be turned off).
Insert/Move/Erase/Divide toolbar have no menu (can't be turned off).

I'm going by the software design premise that with a few notable exceptions (such as your playback toolbar), every function in the software should be reachable by the menu system. This is important because menu items contain hot keys. What's the hotkey for the pan control? Is there one? If it was listed on the menu then users could peruse the entire menu system to familiarize themselves with the functions available and learn the hotkeys to navigate faster. The BaseCamp menu system right now has icons on menu items that have no corresponding toolbar button (Print, several on Edit, full screen, Google Earth, Sort By...). I'm not sure why you chose to put icons on some menu items and not others, but the point of having a graphical representation on a menu item is so users can identify menu items with graphical toolbar buttons. Right now it's not consistent.

You could argue that some of the menu items I'm pointing out which don't have toolbar buttons don't need them, but I'm thinking of items that I've had to hunt in the menu to get to with frequency. Menu items used a lot (typically identified with hotkeys) are candidates for toolbar buttons.

Tiny map overview? You can adjust the mini map size to your liking.

Noted. I'd suggest making the default size larger to make it more useful on first view, probably 3-4x the size of the center view box.

Yes, the floating windows overlap stuff. Before we have received many complaints by users that they felt there was not enough screen real estate left. So we moved the properties and the mini map out, leaving much more room (especially on wide screen monitors).

Dockable windows would make both camps happy.

I apologize for any terse tone in my previous post. I'm just not used to a company as large as Garmin putting a release version of software out that has this many problems, especially one that results in my data getting destroyed every time I fire up the app. Once I slept on it I realized that this is what we've got to work with so I might as well go with the flow. I've been a software developer for the past 20 years so I'm a bit more sensitive to the whole process.

As a final note here, I'd seriously suggest implementing a public beta phase for BaseCamp. That way people expect bugs and won't depend on the thing working right out the gate. When it doesn't, they're much more likely to offer feedback rather than criticism since it's been branded as a work in progress. Always provide a link to the last good release version and the beta. After things have ironed themselved out, call it the release version.

See the two attachments. On data left, the search box is at the bottom of the list and no buttons are available for filtering. On data right, the search box is at the top and now I have filter capability, but now the map controls are gone from the map view.

This is by design. One view is focused on data management, therefore offering more functionality for filtering and sorting data. The other is focused on the map.

Properties menu item has no toolbar button (and no hotkey).
Print has no toolbar button (although "New" does).
Recenter Map up, Align North have no toolbar button (but they have hotkeys).
Detail level toolbar has no menu (and is a toolbar that can't be turned off).
"Vehicle type" toolbar has no menu (and is a toolbar that can't be turned off).
Pan/Zoom/Select/Measure toolbar have no menu (can't be turned off).
Insert/Move/Erase/Divide toolbar have no menu (can't be turned off).

Thanks for pointing this out. We will re-visit this stuff for a future release and see if we can get more consistent.

... results in my data getting destroyed every time I fire up the app...

The data issue is of great concern to us and we hope to have a fix soon.

As a final note here, I'd seriously suggest implementing a public beta phase for BaseCamp.

https://forums.garmin.com/showthread.php?t=19393
https://forums.garmin.com/showthread.php?t=18929

We did come out with 2 Betas even. :)

I stand corrected,I did find the data view with the number of data that I had .But still lost my lists under My Collection.

To restore your lists, go to File->Restore... and select the backup file you made before installing the update. All your lists will be there.

This is by design. One view is focused on data management, therefore offering more functionality for filtering and sorting data. The other is focused on the map.

Ok, I understand where you're trying to go with this now. This is about real estate. I see that some items (like tracks) have a lot of data fields that need to be displayed horizontally so a thin vertical list on the left won't display it well. Swap it to the right, bigger list, can filter now, map takes lesser priority.

But the problem is that it's inconsistent. Whether the data or map is on the left or right, they should be the exact same thing, only sized differently. Why is the search box on bottom when the data view is on the left and on the top when it's on the right? Why is the filter capability only on the right? Is there a programmatic reason for it? If not, put the filters on the left view but just have them cut off if the list isn't wide enough. Keep the search box on the top regardless of position. The more things change, the more confusing they are. The only thing that should be different is the position of the window for a different view size--nothing else. If you want other things to be different, call them a different view (basic data, expanded data or whatever).

Same with the map view. Is there a reason in the programming of the application that you can't have the map controls on both sides? If not, they should be there. Same, same, same.

But really, the way to solve this is with multiple user views. Two would be enough for most purposes. Stand on the shoulders of giants on this one--Adobe Photoshop. That application is the absolute staple of raster graphics worldwide and it's imperitive that the workflow be easy while maximizing real estate for the images. Photoshop has two docking "zones" on the left and right side of the app window that you can put any number of windows in, or you can nest the windows within each other in a tabbed format (very much like 3.1.3s My Collection/Properties/Elevation/Notes). You can float the windows around the interface or dock them.

BaseCamp has map, data, library, properties, elevation profile, notes, and map overview windows. The map is synonymous to Photoshop's image--unless told otherwise, it covers the whole window. User puts other windows in the interface as desired--docking, floating, hidden, stay on top, whatever...but here's the real power:

In Photoshop, users can get the windows looking like they want and save the configuration as a workspace. Then they just have to select the workspace for the task they're working on and all the windows set themselves to that task. So do a subset of that for BaseCamp. Have two views (like what you tried to accomplish for 3.2.1) but make them completely customizable and keep the functionality within each window the same. The TAB key swaps between views. Then users have their own data and map views with size, position, floating, etc.

And there ya go. :)

We did come out with 2 Betas even.

And not a single tester identified the "fix data" problem over the whole course of the beta? That's just.....hmmmm.