Forerunner with Elevate 5

I do not need bling bling, I love MIP

Absolutely right. As for DCR everyone should get what it can/want from his opinions and reviews. He is clearly stating that Garmin and others are sending him devices for reviews and tests. All this is not free. Some salt should be taken with all this type of influencers.

If you want a Forerunner with MIP display and Elevate 5 then you should get a Fenix

I know I would. It is more expensive but the grass seems greener on that side in terms of FW release quality and support.

ep013 said:

I cringe every time DCR dismisses every concern raised about amoled with patronising platitudes though:  "I have no problems with visibility outdoors", "that only happened with old Amoled", "you get used to it", "no one really complains about it", "battery life is good enough". 

I agree 100% but he's just doing his job.

Despite his ever present disclaimer that he doesn't accept advertising and always sends review units back (with the intent of purchasing his own unit), it's his job to review and implicitly promote new products in the industry, especially Garmin products (which constitute the focus of his main audience.)

DCR and other sportswatch influencers are not going to thrive by explaining you don't need to buy a new watch, or that AMOLED has tradeoffs you might not be happy with. Same as The Verge (notorious for loving Apple products) is not going to tell you to stop buying new tech (despite making a show of criticizing capitalism and worrying about climate change.)

It's kind of funny that when Polar came out with a feature which is supposed to provide persistent AMOLED visibility in bright sunlight, by constantly flipping between "bright" and "super bright" modes during an activity, he walked a fine line between "this is a great feature, especially for cyclists" and "you may be mystified as to why this is necessary."

For what it's worth, I do think in terms of ethics, writing quality, and content, he's head and shoulders above the rest. (Probably partly because he was the first out of the gate. EDIT: Or maybe I have it backwards and those things are the reasons that he was the first successful endurance sports tech blogger.)

As a runner, I wouldn't get a Fenix because it's heavier, and because I've seen first hand the problem where at least one generation of Fenix had terrible GPS quality (perhaps because it has a metal body, as opposed to the Forerunner's plastic body.) I ran a downtown 5k race with a friend - my watch recorded something like 5.05 km (1% error, which is fine in my books) while his watch recorded around 5.6 km (ridiculous). Our watches were from the same generation and had similar software, but I had a forerunner 935 and he had a fenix 5.

It's anecdotal evidence for sure, but I saw people in the Fenix forums complaining about GPS accuracy at the time, and it soured my impression of the brand forever.

AMOLED can also suffer from burn-in, which MiP LCD doesn't suffer from.

nowster said:

AMOLED can also suffer from burn-in, which MiP LCD doesn't suffer from.

As long as it takes long enough, Garmin might see that as a feature not a bug. Same as most of us have gotten used to non-replaceable (well, not easily replaceable) laptop and phone batteries that degrade to the point of uselessness within 5 years.

Garmin would love it if more of their customers started replacing their watches at the same rate they replace their phones (every 2-3 years, at least in recent history, for some people), rather than what I see where many runners hold on to their garmins for 5-10 years.

I'm sure you are right. Fenix lines has its own set of issues, weight included, but from release notes for FW and forum activities the team behind it seems better that what we got. Of course I have no proof for this is just a feel.

I previously had an Apple watch and what made me switch to Garmin was the promise of better and more detailed fitness tracking and training support and the MIP display. I personally prefer MIP over AMOLED.

Yeah I'm not saying Fenix is bad in 2024 (or even in the past), I just have my own reasons for preferring Forerunner. They're obviously different, and I don't think a Fenix is a drop-in replacement for a Forerunner.

I've tried Apple Watch and the WorkOutdoors app which is supposed to be a replacement for Garmin functionality. While the app is nice, I would never replace my Garmin with an Apple Watch unless I was forced to. Personally, I want the ability to start, stop and lap an activity with simple button presses (which means I don't have to look at the watch.) Sure WorkoutDoors allows you to assign secondary functions to gestures such as "rotate digital crown" but it's not really the same thing for me. I also like Garmin's turn by turn navigation (although it only really works well if you prep the route on your phone or computer, as opposed to trying to generate a route on the device, from what I've heard.) Garmin also has a totally different philosophy where the majority of the features are usable without a phone. On Apple Watch, you can't even look at your activity history without a phone. I'm in the Garmin "ecosystem", for better or worse.

If I didn't run I'd probably go with an Apple Watch, just like the majority of people who want a smartwatch / fashion accessory / status symbol.

I will say that I got my 955 when the 965 was already out, and it was the first time I bought a new Garmin that wasn't the latest model. So for me, AMOLED and its tradeoffs were a big dealbreaker.

I might just stick with my 955 forever. I know some pretty fast runners who still rock a 235. Or maybe I'll get the first microLED Forerunner if and when it comes out.

Yeah I can agree with that line of thought. There's obviously the goal of trying to attract or stop users from going the Apple route, but there's good evidence that Garmin's MIP watches simply last for a very long time in many cases. I think the 235 is still the most popular watch on Strava or has been until recently.

Especially with Always-on, normalising battery life and therefore total lifespan that's half or less than it could be is a heck of a way to solve that business problem. So OK, it can be mitigated with gesture mode, but it's kinda sad to have a watch with a watch face that's completely black by default.

I think that normalisation is also why all user choice must be removed, it would not work if they leave a popular Forerunner with a MIP display. They're almost there too, with probably the Instinct and Fenix as exceptions. The Instinct because it's niche enough, and the Fenix might justify a long lifespan by the extremely high price tag.

I bought a brand new 255 just in case. I considered the Fenix but even the 7s is too heavy and thick, plus I wasn't convinced about the reported lack of display clarity from the sapphire + solar combination.

Who knows what the future will bring, also wishing MicroLED or something better is ready by the time my 255 expires :-)