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The Garmin Mess (my opinion) of Optical HR

gxgene1
7 months ago

Three Visuals included.

1.The first is a 10 miles non stop flat run, on software 22.20. Note that about 10 minutes into the run the HR takes a sudden, unexplainable jump

2. 35 minutes on a stair climber. After the exercise ends I kept the watch recording and over the next 10 minutes the HR peaks twice to a level higher than at any time during the exercise and then drifts down in what looks like a repeatable pattern

3. A 5k run with a stepper hill. At about .4 miles in the HR does a straight up vertical jump from 126 bpm to 150 bpm!

The above is indisputable, below are my opinions and represent my experiences with the watch.

I can't say if these problems affect all users or just a subset. I can say for me the FR 265's Elevate Gen 4 Optical HR sensor is a real disappointment (compared to the FR 245 Elevate Gen 3 Optical HR sensor). To the point of; Garmin, I love the user interface and some of the features of the FR265 but fix the optical HR or just give me my money back.

OR - recall the watches with the Elevate 4 sensor, replace with the Elevate 3 sensor and the software to support the Elevate 3. OK, that's pie in the Sky, the user can't replace the battery in the watch, the optical HR sensor isn't going to be replaced.

OR Replace my watch with an equivalent that actually works! A LOT of the metrics I care about are based off of the HR readings. If the HR readings are bunk, then obviously the metrics follow suite. Again, my opinion but if the optical HR doesn't work reasonably (at least as well as it did in the FR245) then the watch does not meet the advertised standards for it's intended use.

I can live with the HR missing rapid peaks or having to install the newly released software twice because after the first install the watch forgot it had an HR sensor or even the random breakage of some features after a software "upgrade" as long as the core functions continue to work (or are fixed); I can't live with the core function of the HR not working reasonably.

  • 0 1 month ago in reply to mihu86

    My take on this, and it is just my take, is they make a lot of changes and the changes come in software pieces, i.e. the sensor hub, which is why some folks have to go through the secret menu light button software reinstall. It happened to me, the HR sensor wasn't there after an update and a reinstall fixed it. Whatever other changes if any the algorithm is tied to, we certainly have no way of knowing. 

    That said, I'll bet if Garmin was willing; and a user was willing to accept the negative consequences for some features, Garmin could if they wanted put out a matrix chart of compatible software components and allow a user to download the software versions that best fit their particular needs.

    That's a nightmare scenario for Garmin:

    1. You're flat out admitting the software has problems (even though it does).

    2. The chart has to be created and all the various versions made available to download.

    3. Every release something seems to get broken, no one probably has a total idea of the consequences of mixing and matching versions, though I personally don't see the harm in allowing a user to revert to a complete older release...

    4. Except, lets say that a necessary GPS fix came out in a later version and reverting back to get the best HR performance looses the GPS update, which then Garmin would need to correct in all the previous releases.

    5. Now users are calling in with weird problems across a multitude of software releases and the first question Support always asks is, have you upgraded to the latest software? They don't have the resources to troubleshoot a myriad of mixed software pieces.

    But I totally agree with you. Regardless if some interesting things were addressed in later changes to algorithm; if the basic function of the HR sensor to reasonably measure heart rate doesn't work, Garmin Should and NEEDS to go back to the best version of measuring HR, if that doesn't work the rest is bunk because so much of it is based on HR. 

    I REALLY like my FR265, the display is great but if Garmin doesn't fix the issue with optical HR on the 265  (which also means it might be applicable to the 255 - same sensor) to be at least as good as my FR245 I'm not buying another Garmin watch. With one possible exception, if by means of sort of an apology for the consternation this has caused so many users, IF Garmin comes out with a newer watch with an optical HR sensor and software that is proven to work and they offer us trodden down users ONE HECK of a discount on the new (proven through forum posts to work) watch /HR sensor, maybe I'll buy in.

  • 0 1 month ago in reply to gxgene1

    Same problems with the Forerunner 955 since 1,5 years. The old Software 15.19 was ok, but now we still have 25.02 and it is sucks. You can not trust the optical sensor and garmin do nothing.

    My Son has the FR 265 and the same problems like me with my FR955.

    But you can buy Garmin Connect+ (Premium) now, whats a ***.

  • 0 1 month ago in reply to b34bc31d02d14841b7059474182b2635

    In my opinion folks need to vote with their pocket books for serious issues. By serious issues I mean the core functions, like HR, GPS, and reasonable Elevation gain. I'm not saying that other issues aren't important but (and I'm being facetious), if the elevation gain obtained from a thousand Pogo stick jumps is off, for 99.89% of all users it's not life changing.

    If the basic core functions don't work, especially HR, and even more especially if a previous version of the software is known to make that core function work significantly better, to the point of being reliable within the constraints of what can be expected from optical HR measurement Garmin has a responsibility and a duty to address it.

    Users have a responsibility and a duty to encourage Garmin by voting with how they spend.

  • 0 1 month ago in reply to gxgene1

    It is kind of funny how their latest update says 

    • Improve some cases where wrist-based heart rate could appear unusually elevated during activity.

    I've had the opposite for the last year or so. Going on a simple walk stuck in the 60s for 20+ minutes. Strength training, which I have more lenience towards, catering to the 40s for no reason at all. I have many email threads with them and they clearly will not fix it at this point. 

  • 0 1 month ago in reply to 6887522

    Expect disappointment and you will never be disappointed Grinning 

  • 0 1 month ago in reply to Rohan Arora

    The sayings that come to my mind;

    Fool me once shame on you, Fool me twice shame on me.  

    and;

    What goes around, comes around.