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  • Pace Issue

    FWIW- This was a response from Garmin that someone on another forum got regarding the pace issue:
    "Thank you for contacting Garmin International. I will be happy to assist you with this. A fix for this problem in the current pace field is being worked on currently and should be released soon to correct this problem. Until then, you may try switching to field to average pace or a lap average which will smooth the pace reading. Unfortunately I do not have a time frame for this fix but it should be very soon".

  • #2
    That was the reply I got. Let's hope for sooner rather than later!

    Comment


    • #3
      Same issue here. The pace field is unusable. With the "indefinite" time frame, I take it that means it could be years. I'm sadly going to have to return the 910xt tomorrow & perhaps repurchase it when Garmin fixes this epically bad oversight.

      Comment


      • #4
        OK, I don't have a 910XT...yet, but I am eagerly waiting for one. However, I have had the 305 and now use the 310XT. IMHO the instant pace has always been virtually unusable. I'm sure there are forum posts about this on those devices.

        I went out with my 310XT this morning and made a conscious effort to look at the pace on a regular basis - not something I usually do I should add. In the space of a few strides the pace went from 5:25 to 6:10 to 5:43/km while I was running on a flat piece of road. The average pace for the run was 5:38/km. It is not something I have done for a while, but the results are those I remember from previous devices. Is the 310XT any better or worse than the 910XT? I don't know, but if the 910XT is showing the same or similar behaviour then maybe there is no difference and sadly, no improvement.

        It must be incredibly difficult to process the movement of an arm with the movement of the body with the movement of the satellites to yield an instantaneous pace. When you think about, the instantaneous pace IS a combination of how the arm is moving relative to the body and the body relative to the satellites, which is going to be changing constantly. Maybe mount the device in a fixed position on the torso and see how that affects instantaneous pace?

        Should it/could it be better? Arguably yes but how? Rolling 5s/10s/30s averaging perhaps? Processing out wide variances?

        Comment


        • #5
          If you want to use instantaneous pace, you really need a calibrated foot pod. Then set it to use the foot pod for speed. It will still use GPS for lap pace and distance, but the recorded speed will be from the foot pod. If you upload your file, you'll notice the speed graph is significantly smoother using this mechanism.

          Comment


          • #6
            I have had the opposite result. My instantaneous pace with the foot pod varied more than with the GPS.

            Originally posted by EKUTTER View Post
            If you want to use instantaneous pace, you really need a calibrated foot pod. Then set it to use the foot pod for speed. It will still use GPS for lap pace and distance, but the recorded speed will be from the foot pod. If you upload your file, you'll notice the speed graph is significantly smoother using this mechanism.

            Comment


            • #7
              Originally posted by PHILIPSHAMBROOK View Post
              Should it/could it be better? Arguably yes but how? Rolling 5s/10s/30s averaging perhaps? Processing out wide variances?
              For this reason I have always resorted to a combination of Lap Pace and 1 mile auto-laps. If I want to intentionally run a faster or slower interval I will add a manual lap button press.

              Still I agree with you and wish they could have averaging much like they do for Power on the bike (3s, 10s, 30s...)

              My 910xt should be waiting at home today, will report if I see anything useful to contribute with use.

              Comment


              • #8
                Originally posted by PHILIPSHAMBROOK View Post
                OK, I don't have a 910XT...yet, but I am eagerly waiting for one. However, I have had the 305 and now use the 310XT. IMHO the instant pace has always been virtually unusable. I'm sure there are forum posts about this on those devices.

                I went out with my 310XT this morning and made a conscious effort to look at the pace on a regular basis - not something I usually do I should add. In the space of a few strides the pace went from 5:25 to 6:10 to 5:43/km while I was running on a flat piece of road. The average pace for the run was 5:38/km. It is not something I have done for a while, but the results are those I remember from previous devices. Is the 310XT any better or worse than the 910XT? I don't know, but if the 910XT is showing the same or similar behaviour then maybe there is no difference and sadly, no improvement.

                It must be incredibly difficult to process the movement of an arm with the movement of the body with the movement of the satellites to yield an instantaneous pace. When you think about, the instantaneous pace IS a combination of how the arm is moving relative to the body and the body relative to the satellites, which is going to be changing constantly. Maybe mount the device in a fixed position on the torso and see how that affects instantaneous pace?

                Should it/could it be better? Arguably yes but how? Rolling 5s/10s/30s averaging perhaps? Processing out wide variances?
                My 305 and 310xt, even without a footpod, work FANTASTIC displaying instant pace readout! It doesn't skew more than 5-10 seconds per mile every 3-5 seconds. Sure, I'll see some jumps like 9:10, 9:15, 9:08 but that's about it...it's usually very very spot on and very consistent. I even have pace smoothing set to 'more' on my 305, not 'most'. It's VERY usable even dialing in fast paced track workouts. I guess you'll just have to see how bad the 910's is....because, it's bad.

                Comment


                • #9
                  Me Too

                  I am having similar issues to other forum users.
                  I upgraded from a FR305 to the new FR 910xt. Running on one of my usual routes the instantaneous pace reading was wildly erratic. My ave pace was 4.55 /km but pace reading swung from 3.00 to over 6.00/km. I have never had this issue with the FR305.I haven't tried but am worried about what it will be like as a bike Speedo!
                  From reading the Garmin forums I understand this is due to no pace smoothing.
                  I urge Garmin to add pace smoothing in the next firmware upgrade and to do so ASAP. This is a major shortcoming in an otherwise excellent product.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Garmin ain't gonna hear you here. Open a ticket and voice your opinion. It will help everyone to get a quick(er) fix.
                    -FR

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Yep, Already done.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Originally posted by POOLEY78 View Post
                        haven't tried but am worried about what it will be like as a bike Speedo!
                        It shouldn't be as much of a problem; the issue is the imprecision in GPS position and Doppler-derived velocity relative to how far you move between fixes, and when you're cycling, you're generally going a good deal faster than when you're running, so the speed reading is less noisy. Somebody commented earlier that the running pace looked tighter even when he was running faster, which makes sense.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Maybe I haven't thought this through and they've done a lot of 'rigorous testing' in all areas of the watch before they released it, but perhaps they should be using different algorithms based on what mode you're in?

                          Bike mode - no smoothing
                          Run - smoothing.

                          The watch has to be in a 'mode' so I struggle to see the reason why they can't do this or haven't already done so.

                          if RUN then
                          if BIKE then

                          Or, they could just give you the choice.... Just a thought.

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Footpod vs. GPS

                            I did some tests with footpod and GPS. My findings below.

                            GPS as per the technology limitation (+/- 5-10m) isn't that accurate as the footpod in the means of actual speed. See explanations because of 'noise' at low speed and doppler effect above. Advantage: there is no need for calibration as with footpod. For the whole exercise the accuracy of distance using GPS is good same as with footpod. Sure if not calibrated good enough, footpod could show quit wrong results. And calibration is needed for different grounds, shoes, speed, ....! So it will be always a compromize. Disadvantage of GPS currently is the actual pace. It jumps as it shows the real actual pace (measured with GPS and therefore not accurate enough, a SW update with 'smoothing' could help out here). I opened a ticked at Garmin support already.
                            My conclusion: If I do a intervall workout, I use the footpod. Same for indoor workouts ;-). For all other outdoor (long jogs, base run, ..) I use GPS and use lap pace to check pace.

                            Comment to the screenshots below: During GPS recorded workout, I had 3 noteable stops or speed reduction because of traffic lights and course. 'Jumps' of pace in GPS recorded workout are quit high between 8min/km and 4:30min/km. Both workouts was compareable in terms of speed. Base runs with about 5:30min/km pace.
                            Attached Files

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              No help from Garmin Australia!

                              I conacted garmin about this pace issue. Here is the response i receievd:

                              Thank you for contacting Garmin Australasia Support

                              To assist you further, please click the link below and update software.
                              https://buy.garmin.com/shop/store/do...t=010-00741-20
                              With kind regards,
                              anna t
                              Garmin Australasia Support Specialist
                              Additional solutions may be found at http://www.garmin.com/garmin/cms/sit.../searchsupport


                              Hopefully they come up with a fix. In the meantime I have ordered a foot pod.

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